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  #81  
Old July 15th, 2014, 11:57 AM
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mark kellgren
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this is not an argument of if it should be illegal. we an all agree vin swapping is. But the fact is that CBP does not know for sure if all these seized vehicles were vin swapped. This warrant was probably based on allegations of just a couple. so I think the way CBP is handling this with 2nd hand owners is very inappropriate for a government agency, given the presumption of innocence paired with the fact that they are seizing a possible legitimate vehicle from a legitimate owner that has full legal right to that vehicle.

hitting an owners house the same way they raid a crack house is just pure stupid and wrong. they should be coming by to ask if they can do an onsite inspection with a SME, or blocking registration renewal until an inspection is done by a SME.

I'm willing to bet the majority of those 160 end up having to be given back. I would love to see the warrant case on the mass seizures, but I'll be the argument could be made that for many, there was insufficient evidence to warrant the seizure.

Just because the CBP is doing it with a warrant, doesn't mean the single judge they used to obtain the warrant was correct.
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  #82  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:00 PM
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Ray Gerber
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the rover shop View Post
I'm wondering if they are seizing anything that was even worked on in that particular shop..just in case they received non-compliant parts onto them.. Hard to imagine that he imported 185 defenders.. 25 already seized and another 160..??? What happens if the truck isn't there when they come knocking.. Like if its been sold or even if its just stored off premises... What's their power then.??
Custom's jurisdiction is rather broad, akin to postal inspectors exceptionally broad powers. Ironically it is much more than the FBI, DEA, etc.

Would seem they are pulling on all the strings to see what will come loose. 160 vehicles is a lot, and one wonders if this is broader than just a LR community affair.
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  #83  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:02 PM
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Bill Larson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fishEH View Post
I own three D1's so let them have fun.

So for those with seized trucks; are you able to recover personal property that was in or bolted to the vehicle? Like seat covers, winches, lights, etc?
personal items but nothing attached...alot of times it's up to the team leader.
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  #84  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:05 PM
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Phillip
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maybe you should call your congressman or other elected officials. someone really has a hard on for the Dr. seems like a huge waste of tax dollars seizing Land Rovers. I met a U.S. Marshall once, he was an asshole of epic proportions.
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  #85  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:07 PM
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Frank Rafka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
this is not an argument of if it should be illegal. we an all agree vin swapping is. But the fact is that CBP does not know for sure if all these seized vehicles were vin swapped. This warrant was probably based on allegations of just a couple. so I think the way CBP is handling this with 2nd hand owners is very inappropriate for a government agency, given the presumption of innocence paired with the fact that they are seizing a possible legitimate vehicle from a legitimate owner that has full legal right to that vehicle.

hitting an owners house the same way they raid a crack house is just pure stupid and wrong. they should be coming by to ask if they can do an onsite inspection with a SME, or blocking registration renewal until an inspection is done by a SME.

I'm willing to bet the majority of those 160 end up having to be given back. I would love to see the warrant case on the mass seizures, but I'll be the argument could be made that for many, there was insufficient evidence to warrant the seizure.

Just because the CBP is doing it with a warrant, doesn't mean the single judge they used to obtain the warrant was correct.

It's evidence being gathered for a federal case, maybe a legal type can interject some insight on seizures related to a on going investigation. From what I've been told, if it's legal, you can get the truck back at some point, If it's proven to be illegal, your screwed.
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  #86  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:11 PM
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Holy cow.
I'm sincerely sorry for you guys

It sucks.
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  #87  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:13 PM
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shayne young
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyboyUpstate View Post
I'm in Albany, NY. My 1983 ROW 110 was seized today at about 9AM.

It was parked at my fathers house about 15 minutes from where I live. It is registered to my home address not my fathers. My poor mother with cancer and my old man who is laid off had ~ 10 Homeland Security officers banging on their door screaming at them if they had any weapons at 8AM on a Tuesday.

I spoke with the agent over the phone who wouldn't tell me his first name. He says I have to meet him at his office and have some type of interview and maybe I will get the vehicle back. He also tells me that the 110 is a model year 2000. I told him to LOOK AT IT AND TELL ME IT'S A 2000. He said that's not for him to judge. It's a 1983 Land Rover 110. End of story.

I am the 3rd US owner and the truck is titled in NYS. I have all the importing paperwork assuming it is legit. I will report back what happens.

What a mismanagement of taxpayer money.

I JUST finished replacing the clutch yesterday. Sons of bitches.
So how did they know it was at your fathers house and not where it was registered at..??? Regarding the vins... Surely they know the uk vins don't match up to the USA vins... What was the 10th digit of your truck.. That may read as a 2000 truck in USA vin codes..USA 2000 would have been a Y..

------ Follow up post added July 15th, 2014 01:20 PM ------

Y should be 2000 regardless of UK or USA.. The same letters for USA vs uk from 1995..
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  #88  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:32 PM
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Abraham Bell
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So the count is up to 5 that we know of?
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  #89  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:35 PM
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Frank Rafka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
How do you know so much? Source?

-Jeff
friends in high places...
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  #90  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by 101stAirborne View Post
This is like watching your friends house burn
I was just thinking, it is kinda like watching a friend burn up his kitchen, then instead of fixing it, he just seals it off and starts cooking his meth in the next room.
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  #91  
Old July 15th, 2014, 12:57 PM
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Will Hedrick
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I'd be interested in examining a copy of the warrant, if one were inclined to share it that is.
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  #92  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:00 PM
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Mike Miller
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Same happened to me this very morning....

7am. Loud Pounding on my door. Then repeats. (I have 3 young kids, all instantly woken.)

I open the door to 8 officers, 3 patrol cars, etc.

They immediately tell me that "don't worrry, I'm the victim here", but oh yeah, "We have a Federal arrest warrant for your Defender. It's a 1995. Not a 1985. We busted the guy in NC who sold it to you. He Rolled."
At this point, I was on with my attorney. Despite paperwork validating that it was '85, these 8 guys had nothing. Not one piece of paper signed or otherwise that says it's not a "1985".
So then I asked "well VIN aside, as it was obvious they couldn't validate it's year themselves, what do you look for that tips you off to Vin/Swap, and does this vehicle have them?"
Walks around...listing the typical things and clearly says outloud "yes your vehicle doesn't appear to have any of the tell tail signs and "could be an '85. And if it is...you'll have no problem getting it back". (Yes, comforting.)

Their job = get car. I get that. You got it.

But now who do you have that can validate it's either what you say it is (1995) or what I say it is.

I live in a nice, clean, gated community. For which my neighbors all clearly think I'm a drug dealer, thanks to this AM's obvious raid.

Rest assured fellow Defender lovers....8 took 8 officers to finally subdue her. But ultimately they arrived with a flat bed.
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  #93  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:02 PM
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Gustavo
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Originally Posted by mongosd2 View Post
friends in high places...
What a crock of shit

Frank, when I said I know you I actually sing this

http://youtu.be/mvCgSqPZ4EM
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  #94  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:03 PM
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Quick question for Rocky009… are you a 3rd party owner or the original purchaser from the dealership in NC

------ Follow up post added July 15th, 2014 01:04 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugbier View Post
What a crock of shit

Frank, when I said I know you I actually sing this

http://youtu.be/mvCgSqPZ4EM
Your a funny guy Goose…
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  #95  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:08 PM
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Keith Armstrong
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.nevermind... .
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  #96  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:08 PM
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Mike Miller
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I purchased it from the NC Dealership

------ Follow up post added July 15th, 2014 11:09 AM ------

In 2010.
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  #97  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:09 PM
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Jeff B
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Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
How do you know so much? Source?

-Jeff
Frank's the Mole!


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  #98  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by mongosd2 View Post
Quick question for Rocky009… are you a 3rd party owner or the original purchaser from the dealership in NC

------ Follow up post added July 15th, 2014 01:04 PM ------



Your a funny guy Goose…
I know :-)
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  #99  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:14 PM
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Frank Rafka
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Frank's the Mole!


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Funny...
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  #100  
Old July 15th, 2014, 01:25 PM
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Harry
1978 88"
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Hello people I am active member on other UK based forums. I am sorry to hear about your losses but joined to tell you this

There is no such thing as a 25 year old Defender. Not till next year. The first Defender rolled off the production line in 1990. What your importing is, or should be, a 1984-1989 Land Rover Ninety or One-Ten or One-Two-Seven.

The name changed to 110 and 90 sometime between about 1988 I think. The Nineties and One-Tens had the pencil lock door tops inside the cab and the flat black plastic inner door handles, the Range Rover four spoked steering wheel and often outer recessed door handles like a Series and from about 1984-1986 the angled sliding cab windows with round spin lock on.

They also will have at first had 2.25 petrol and diesel 5 main bearing engines and then 2.5 Diesel and Petrol non turbos and then the turbo 19j engines till 1990. The TDI was released in 1990 though many were retro fitted.

Please be vigilant. A 25 year old Defender does not exist.
Thank you and good luck I joined for the sole purpose of helping by supplying info from
The home country!

Thank you.
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