Help Put Together a Seller's Guide Sticky - For Sale Vehicles - Defender Source
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Old February 20th, 2014, 01:38 PM
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Help Put Together a Seller's Guide Sticky - For Sale Vehicles

Charles had suggested a seller's guide be put together that he can make a sticky, so that new members can be pointed to the thread. I started putting one together, and figured I should open it up to everyone else for completeness for things sellers often forget to provide in terms of info, but which you see as highly valuable. I'll then put it all back together and submit it for a sticky.

I'm also putting together a Buyer's Guide thread, since as I was putting together a list of the photos a seller should supply, I realized we also need a comprehensive list as a sticky for prospective buyers to look at, since we often re-hash the same stuff for newer members.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

**READ BEFORE POSTING** Sellers: Best Practices For A Successful/Complete For Sale Ad

So you want to sell your vehicle. It can be an emotional decision, so to make the transition as easy as possible for everyone, a list of pointers on how to post a productive and efficient for sale ad has been provided below. Productive and efficient for sale ads are those ads that provide as much information as possible, so that potential buyers have almost all of the information they need to make a decision about whether or not to purchase your vehicle, without much back-and-forth before the negotiation process. Inefficient ads are those that leave buyers either searching for the information themselves or require the seller to dole out the same additional information piecemeal to each prospective buyer.


First, read the rules for the For Sale Vehicles section:
http://www.defendersource.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3572


Aside from the rules listed in the above link, if you are quickly putting together a for sale ad, please provide at least the following information about your vehicle:


1) Price – mention if you are firm, negotiable, etc. if applicable. Research what comparable vehicles have been listed for recently to help determine what your vehicle may be worth. If cross-posting from your eBay ad, list the reserve per the forum rules.

2) Location - if your location and the location of the vehicle are different, note this as well

3) Make – Example: Land Rover

4) Model – Examples: NAS Defender 90 (hard top or soft top), NAS 110, etc.

5) Year – Examples: 1993, 1994, 1995, 1997

6) Color – At the very least, listing the color provides a keyword which helps others when searching for a particular color either to purchase or for other research

7) Miles - Overall miles, as well as total miles on any major running gear or other components replaced

8) VIN (if you are comfortable with this) and/or the NAS plaque number (if applicable)

9) Title Condition (if known) – I would highly recommend you run your own AutoCheck and/or Carfax and inspect them both for any surprises or potential points of interest prior to listing your vehicle. Additionally, providing these to prospective buyers shows you have nothing to hide. Additionally, if there is an active lien on the vehicle, and the title is not in your name or is lost, this should be mentioned in your ad.

10) Overall Condition – Note the condition of the exterior, interior, frame, any rust issues, etc. (details below). Break down the condition of each of those components individually to provide a clearer picture.

11) Options – both factory/dealer options – such as A/C, fiberglass hard top, rear bench seat (or jump seats) - or aftermarket options – such as upgraded stereo/sound system, Tuffy center console, etc. If it's a soft top, note the brand of the top, how old/new (if known), color, etc. If you have multiple tops, describe them.

12) Pictures – the greater the number of photos you can provide, the better. Your photos should back-up and support your overall determination of the condition of your vehicle. Be sure to provide exterior and interior photos, as well as the frame, doors, bulkhead or any other areas prone to rust. If additional photos are uploaded elsewhere, then also provide the link(s) to those.
How to upload photos: http://www.defendersource.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51655
Note: the above only provides details on how to upload photos using a laptop or desktop computer. If you are using a mobile device, it is recommended that you download the forum’s mobile application:
http://www.defendersource.com/forum/showthread.php?t=37685

13) Your Contact Information - Provide either a phone number or e-mail address and the best time to contact you, etc. If you are uncomfortable providing these publically, then tell them to message you privately through the forum or provide another way in which they can contact you with any further questions.

14) Text/Description - Keep your text/description as concise and complete as possible, while focusing on the details and facts of the vehicle. Descriptions should provide any additional information that sets your vehicle apart from the others, above and beyond just how many miles your vehicle has, or which model it is. This should include any major service your vehicle has received, major tune-ups or recent service, any upgrades to your vehicle (such as a new soft top, running boards, etc.), any off-road or on-road accessories, and/or any comfort accessories such as heated seats, etc. Major components that have been either rebuilt or replaced/upgraded should also be mentioned. If there have been any major changes, such as an engine swap or a color change, then these should also be noted. Additionally, and not necessarily required (but sometimes helpful), the reason why you are selling the vehicle.

If you are advertising the vehicle for sale here, then post the full ad description here. Merely posting a link to another site where your ad description is located creates additional steps for your prospective buyers. Know your audience – if the vehicle is posted on multiple sites, then the description that works on one site may need to be altered for another; tailor your message accordingly. But, if the vehicle is posted elsewhere, also provide the links to those sites (eBay or other auction sites) so that prospective buyers can track its progress.

Try to stay away from repeatedly mentioning how “rare” your vehicle is, or that the vehicle must be seen to be appreciated. Providing as much information as possible will ensure an efficient process for both you and prospective buyers.
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  #2  
Old February 20th, 2014, 01:45 PM
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I think it's pretty good. The one thing I would add under price is reserve for auctions if it has one
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Old February 20th, 2014, 01:47 PM
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I think it's pretty good. The one thing I would add under price is reserve for auctions if it has one
Thanks. Added.
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Old February 20th, 2014, 01:54 PM
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  #5  
Old February 20th, 2014, 02:00 PM
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For pictures, I would link to an ad where someone did a good job as most people have no idea where the things rust to take the pictures and then everyone flames them for trying to hide something when they really just don't know.
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Old February 20th, 2014, 02:22 PM
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For pictures, I would link to an ad where someone did a good job as most people have no idea where the things rust to take the pictures and then everyone flames them for trying to hide something when they really just don't know.
Agreed. I remember a few very complete ads where you had said they should be made into stickies and had searched for them last week when I put this list together but couldn't find them. I'll search around a little again and see what I come up with.

I had originally started putting together a step-by-step "know your truck before you sell" type of thing but it got too long in a hurry and was heading in the wrong direction, so I condensed it into the list you see above. Here was how it started originally:

1) Decide whether or not you are actually ready to sell your truck. Far too often, sellers place their vehicles up for sale and then throughout the ad say that they may actually just keep it. If this is your current train of thought, then just keep your vehicle for now until you are truly ready to sell.
2) Know your vehicle.
a. What is it? Year, model, original intended market (North American Spec (NAS), military service (ex-mod or other), Special Vehicles competitions, etc.)
b. Inspect your vehicle’s Exterior to determine its condition. Either now or later on after the vehicle has been thoroughly cleaned/detailed in preparation for its sale, you should also take photos of these areas.
i. Body Exterior: Walk around your vehicle. Note any imperfections in the paint or body itself – chipped and/or faded (fading) paint, scrapes, dents, stickers, holes, etc. – should be known. Additional accessories that required additional holes to be drilled should also be noted. Determine the overall condition of the body and grade it 1-10, with 10 being the best.
ii. Exterior (rollcage): Inspect your vehicle’s rollcage (if fitted). Note the condition of the powdercoating, any rust bubbles or scrapes/dents in the steel portion of the cage. Inspect the foam portion of your rollcage (if fitted). Note any chunks in the foam, sun staining, snaps missing, etc. Grade it 1-10
iii. Exterior (bumpers): Inspect your vehicle’s bumpers. Note the make and model of them if they are not original equipment to your vehicle. Note the condition of the powdercoating, any rust bubbles or scrapes/dents or creases in the steel portion of the bumpers. Grade it 1-10
iv. Frame: inspect your vehicle’s frame in sections: front (forward of front axle), middle (between the front and rear axles), rear (behind the rear axle). Note any rust or previous patches/replacements to the frame due to rust. Note any dents or tweaks in the frame that may show the vehicle was previously either in an accident or offroaded extensively. Grade each section or overall 1-10
v. Leaks: Note any fluid leaks from your vehicle, and where they are originating from
vi. Bulkhead (this is the steel barrier that separates the driver from the engine bay). Note any rust visible from outside near the side-view mirrors, the engine bay, or by looking at it through the front wheel wells. Note any rust and grade it. Additional inspections of this are to be conducted from the interior.
vii. Doors: the doors primarily rust from the inside out, and usually at the bottom corners or anywhere where there is steel, or where the aluminum and steel meet. Note any rust and/or holes. Grade overall 1-10
c. Inspect your vehicle’s Interior to determine its condition. Either now or later on after the vehicle has been thoroughly cleaned/detailed in preparation for its sale, you should also take photos of these areas.
i. Seats: any tears in the covering, or sagging in the foam?
ii. Trim: note any additional holes drilled into the dash or elsewhere
iii. Bulkhead/floors
iv. I would suggest to any prospective seller(s) that you run your own AutoCheck and/or Carfax report(s) so that you know right up front if there are any title issues surrounding your vehicle.
d. Title Condition
i. Clean: a clean title is one without any accidents or salvage history. Changes in ownership are

3) Do your homework. Research what your truck is worth. The For Sale Vehicles section here is a great place to start. I would also suggest you run your own AutoCheck and/or Carfax reports so that you are prepared in every way possible The price you should ask for your vehicle should depend on a few different factors:
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  #7  
Old February 20th, 2014, 03:10 PM
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Josh, have you seen the ECR buyers guide/slide show they have? It's pretty good. Also, Rugged Guide has a series of YouTube vids (maybe 2 or 3 part series) that are pretty helpful.
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  #8  
Old February 20th, 2014, 03:17 PM
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Thanks. Work in progress.

Feel free to use any of the images if they can help:

http://eastcoastrover.smugmug.com/Ca...1089309_v5Fpcf

Only thing I would add to your list is if the seller has the title, or if the title is at a bank. It makes a difference to some buyers.
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  #9  
Old February 20th, 2014, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by ECR View Post
Thanks. Work in progress.

Feel free to use any of the images if they can help:

http://eastcoastrover.smugmug.com/Ca...1089309_v5Fpcf
Yup I was going to link to that when I was putting it together last week just never got around to it. If you have a bunch of detailed pics from that brown NAS 110 you guys did a few years ago I'd be interested in throwing those in side-by-side to show how bad a bulkhead gets, and then I'll look around for "moderate" rust examples of those same areas to add in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ECR View Post
Only thing I would add to your list is if the seller has the title, or if the title is at a bank. It makes a difference to some buyers.
That's a good one. I'll add that into the title section.
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Old February 20th, 2014, 04:35 PM
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Ex MOD buyer guuide vid

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  #11  
Old February 20th, 2014, 05:05 PM
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Unless newbies are going to have to read the entire post AND pass a test before posting/joining i doubt Josh's hard work will pay off.
I would suggest that any ad that don't conform be deleted and they can start over again if they wish.

15) What Happened To My Ad? You were missing something listed above so your ad was deleted. If you repost please be sure you include ALL the required items above
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Old February 25th, 2014, 01:29 AM
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In the business world, we call this "business logic" and use a web form to enforce these rules onto anyone who makes a vehicle for sale post.

In other words, create a series of web pages to guide a user who wants to put up a "vehicles for sale" post. These web pages would not allow one to post an ad without having specific fields filled out.
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Old March 5th, 2014, 09:30 AM
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Anyone else before I edit this and make it a sticky?
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Old March 5th, 2014, 10:25 AM
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Admittedly I have not read this entire thread. Frankly it bores me and I don't personally see the need to tell someone how they should sell something. Where else do you see this? Craigslist and eBay are wildly successful with less advice.

With that said, i do think a Buyer's and Seller's Guide is appropriate.

Is all this writing going to provide buyers comfort to make a buying decision without human interaction? I hope not.

My vote is to keep things simple and let buyer/seller hash things out like the big kids do. If folks have questions, for gods sake let them ask and let those with constructive advice pipe in as opposed to telling them to go search it yourself.

I don't get why every dog, cat and child need to be in the middle these transactions in the first place. This happens all the time and it makes no sense to me. Sorry, if I'm missing something important here but I don't understand why our for sale section works this way. Is it like this on other boards? I don't know if it is cause I'm not on other boards.

Clay
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Old March 5th, 2014, 10:36 AM
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Clay this is not only a place to buy and sell things, but is also an enthusiast board. As such, enthusiasts often look for a little bit more from a for sale ad than the regular joe shmoe over on Craigslist looking for a Hyundai. Many of us have been around here long enough at this point to witness multiple new members come here looking to sell their vehicles, and trying to provide an appropriate amount of information to provide for an enthusiast audience. The additional information also helps to provide additional historical information on a given vehicle...for those of us who like to track the histories of a given vehicle.

If you read the thread you'd see that this was merely a means to make a for sale ad/transaction most EFFICIENT here instead of a required guideline that sellers must follow.
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Old March 5th, 2014, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by rijosho View Post
Clay this is not only a place to buy and sell things, but is also an enthusiast board. As such, enthusiasts often look for a little bit more from a for sale ad than the regular joe shmoe over on Craigslist looking for a Hyundai. Many of us have been around here long enough at this point to witness multiple new members come here looking to sell their vehicles, and trying to provide an appropriate amount of information to provide for an enthusiast audience. The additional information also helps to provide additional historical information on a given vehicle...for those of us who like to track the histories of a given vehicle.

If you read the thread you'd see that this was merely a means to make a for sale ad/transaction most EFFICIENT here instead of a required guideline that sellers must follow.
My vote is to post it ... if it helps people write better ads that are more informative ... great ... if they ignore it that's fine too.
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Old March 5th, 2014, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by rijosho View Post
Clay this is not only a place to buy and sell things, but is also an enthusiast board. As such, enthusiasts often look for a little bit more from a for sale ad than the regular joe shmoe over on Craigslist looking for a Hyundai. Many of us have been around here long enough at this point to witness multiple new members come here looking to sell their vehicles, and trying to provide an appropriate amount of information to provide for an enthusiast audience. The additional information also helps to provide additional historical information on a given vehicle...for those of us who like to track the histories of a given vehicle. If you read the thread you'd see that this was merely a means to make a for sale ad/transaction most EFFICIENT here instead of a required guideline that sellers must follow.
That's cool. No hard, no foul. I just kinda cringed when I started reading through the steps and the question that entered my mind is...will this be used as a club to beat down people that don't follow all the instructions to a T.

Clay
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Old March 5th, 2014, 01:12 PM
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That's cool. No hard, no foul. I just kinda cringed when I started reading through the steps and the question that entered my mind is...will this be used as a club to beat down people that don't follow all the instructions to a T.

Clay
No no. I think I already said it, but I had started writing down those steps and realized it was going in a direction I didn't want it to, so I had started over, and that's where the list in the original post came from. The "steps" were just included here because they had some good detail on parts of the truck to look at and take photos of.
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  #19  
Old June 29th, 2015, 08:23 PM
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If you made a dealer for sale section, for vehicles. If you sell more than "X" number in a given time frame then you have to post in the dealer section or if you are selling under a business name. That is the way most states determine who is a dealer or not.
I also think that if you do not post a picture with a price the add should be taken down or better yet not allowed to post until the required information is posted.
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