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  #21  
Old November 2nd, 2009, 10:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maryland 110
Robert Davis whom you met through the blood bank fridge deal has done a couple of the Isuzu/4hp22 conversions and raves about them.
That's for the 2.8l 4JB1T, right? That's a nice small diesel, but the 4BD1T has a bit more grunt.
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  #22  
Old November 2nd, 2009, 10:49 PM
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I bet that truck is a blast to drive.

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Originally Posted by Willh
http://www.defendersource.com/pic/chevy.html

Just a random thought.


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  #23  
Old November 3rd, 2009, 06:32 AM
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Thanks guys- appreciate all the suggestions.
Doug- Did Robert ever get the MB oil pan resolved- that is a good alternative as well, and fits the ZF allowing the 230 to remain, and lots less fab work overall. He loves the Izusus for sure, as do I.
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  #24  
Old November 3rd, 2009, 07:28 AM
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Dale,
I sent him a link to this thread. Hopefully he will chime in. He sold his 110 with the Isuzu & 4hp22 setup
and was missing it when I spoke with him @ MAR. He said it was the fastest land rover he had ridden in.
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  #25  
Old November 3rd, 2009, 07:53 AM
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Johnathan Tisdale
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cat's meow option...LS2/4l80e/atlas
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  #26  
Old November 3rd, 2009, 07:58 AM
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I vote HS2.8L and LT230. I would also want an auto in this situation, but I'm not sure what would be the best choice. Is the ZF up to the task? From what I've read, I'm not sure.

Also, I just don't think these trucks are really are suitable for serious towing, regardless of drivetrain.
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  #27  
Old November 3rd, 2009, 08:47 AM
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Brad Harris
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oilburner
I vote not a 6BT.
why the anti-vote?

just wondering why you dislike the 6BT...
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  #28  
Old November 3rd, 2009, 06:19 PM
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Robert Davis
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Doug Crother sent me a message that there was a discussion on engines.

Even though I usually don’t post on threads (that sometimes turn to yarns), thought to make an exception and charm in.

We have a number of projects underway that may be of interest, but first you may want to think about a few basic decisions regarding an engine.

Do you want a product of the same marquee?
Do you want diesel or petrol?
If you want diesel do you want to burn WVO and stay away from common rail and an ECU?
Are you going to tow heavy loads regularly?
Do you want to consider high domestic fuel prices in the future as a factor?

Then think about each option suggested and others that are not.
If you intend to tow heavy loads, want a diesel, don’t care if it a Land Rover product, then the 6BT is a good choice.
Can you get the adapter pieces to make it all fit and do you have all the skills and time to make the install? These should all weigh in on the decision process and could easily be laid out on paper or in excel.

We are moving in the direction of using waste oil to power our vehicles and heat our home and workshop and also provide the ability to go off the grid bu running our 12KW Onan diesel generator.

We also have a few interesting engine related projects as follows.

ISUZU 2.8 TD
We have a 1993 Range Rover LWB and a 1984 110 with the ZF (V8 model) mated to the Isuzu 2.8 liter turbo diesel. Both were at the MAR last month and the 110 is powered by WVO on a 2 tank system. This engine is about the same as the 300 TDI except that it does not level out as much and has more top end. We have driven the RR as fast as 95 MPH on flat ground and the petal is only half way down. Like the 300 TDI it will solw down on sharp up-grades.

Diahatsu 2.8 TD
We have installed 2 of these. Performance very is similar to the 300 TDI. One runs on WVO.

Iveco 2.8 TD
We have one of these that we intend to try mated to a Disco 5 speed or automatic. Stay tuned for more on this.

Mercedes Diesels
The indirect injection will run on most any fuel (WVO, SVO, UCO, Biodiesel, Diesel)

We have a 3.0 liter 5cyl TD mounted in a 1993 Range Rover LWB auto that we do not have completed yet.

We are also building a 240 turbo diesel.
This involves machining the block to take the oil squinters at the bottom of the cylinders. The 300 TD rods and pistons fit perfectly because you can match the bore & stroke, and have the injection pump rebuilt to act like the 5 cyl TD. Mount a turbo and this may be as powerful as a 200 TDI. We’ll see once it goes in a Series III 88…

Domestic fuel prices.
Right now the USD is down on the world market and as it drops, it buys less crude, and the pump price is on the rise in USA.

The V8 petrol may be expensive to run as a daily driver for those of us making long commutes. If this is the case, you may want to consider a diesel and research if it will run on waste oil.

Just a few suggestions…
Robert Davis in VA
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  #29  
Old November 3rd, 2009, 06:50 PM
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I say a stroked 4.0L 6cyl from a Jeep, the new 6 speed and an Atlas.
You can easily achieve 300 reliable HP from this and have parts at every corner store wherever you go.
Run built 9" ers front and rear, again parts everywhere and they can be built to near perfection.

I don't see the need for diesel..... you live in the States, not some 3rd world.... hhmmm, maybe soon however.
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  #30  
Old November 4th, 2009, 01:27 AM
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I vote 4BT with an HY turbo, welded shut wastegate, inline pump with a 3k govenor spring, intercooler and you could have an easy 210-220hp with little else than a fuel screw tweak. 250 hp is doable but you will have to keep an eye trained on the exhaust pyro. 300lb less than a 6bt. The 3k govenor spring would really help making that 3rd-4th gear upshift on steep grades with an NV4500. Oh wait, 10k towing.. ya, 6bt
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  #31  
Old November 4th, 2009, 07:17 AM
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I appreciate the input Robert- very much what we discussed at your house earlier this year. I have been driving/altering/building Rovers for the last 15 years. Over that time, I have gone from moderate wheeling, to semihardcore wheeling, and now mostly adventures with the family. I limit my towing -16' car hauler w/ heavy kitted Rover -to about a 3 hour radius typically, as shipping is so cheap right now. It is all about trying to make one truck a jack of all trades, realizing it won't be the master of any. The 6bt is heavy and long, but very well may be the best all around contender. Jury is still out, but really do not want an ECU.
Carey- we did Hi9s w/ 60 outers a few years ago, and have no need to go that route again- for this application. And it will most likely see third world, either in the States :-) or abroad.
Again, thanks all, interesting options and opinions for sure!!
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  #32  
Old November 4th, 2009, 08:00 AM
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The 6bt is heavy- probably nearly as heavy as the Toyota 2h I had in my 110 and would require custom front springs. My other toy is a 31 ft Bertram sportfish used for offshore fishing. A number of my friends with the same boat have the twin 6bta's in them (I have 8.2 liter Detroits). These boats run 120 miles offshore to the canyons for a day of trolling and then back again-ie engines running the entire time-the long high speed runs are usually 300 rpm below max rpm for 4 hours @ a time. The "a" stands for aftercooler, the boating equivalent of an intercooler. These engines easily put out 300-330hp and gobs of torque with zero electronics. These are twelve valve versions not the later 24's and dirt simple to operate and maintain. The primary difference between the marine version and the automotive are a larger oil sump which is easily switched out. Conversion back to automotive would be a piece of cake. Cummins sells remans quite reasonably. I think I would ask why JL doesn't like the 6b in his series three and see how those issues would relate to your project.
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  #33  
Old November 4th, 2009, 09:12 AM
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I pull a steel flatbed trailer loaded with my 30hp Kubota with loader and bushog...close to 10k with my 110 and it does fine. I have a 4.6 that I built with a hi torque cam and 4bbl carb so no electronics except for the dizzy where I opted away from points. The 110 is still great off-road, will idle down to 300 rpm when I want it to and crawls along using the torque. The 5spd is probably the weak link but so far no problems. Not the economy of a diesel but I wanted to be able to tow the trailer with with either my tractor or series 88". Don't rule out the LR 4.6, No replacement for displacement...
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  #34  
Old November 4th, 2009, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maryland 110
I think I would ask why JL doesn't like the 6b in his series three and see how those issues would relate to your project.
I love mine. I do not recommend it. The engine is really too big for a Land-Rover once you factor in the turbo location and all the ancilliaries. Once you modify the bulkhead to clear the big bellhousing, you are left with reduced footwell room. I also think it would not work in a 110 as the front axle trunion bearings would pound themselves to death due to the weight and the front axle location is too far rearward and would probably get into the oil pan (as opposed to a leaf sprung truck that has a better axle location). I used a 110 rear box to move the rear axle rearward so it's actually about 114" wheelbase. A 110 would need a 4-6 inch lift to clear the engine block and my experience with LR coiler suspension seems to show that the LR suspension at this height is not stable enough to be able to handle the torque and high CG. The sprung over modified leaf spring suspension is better in this capacity.

It is one of those things that if you have to ask you do not want one.

I am rebuilding mine to make it more civilized and with more power. I may change my tune once I have spent some time on sound insulation but I have a feeling it will forever be a farm tractor in LR clothing. With the fuel screw cranked up, timing bumped and 4 inch exhaust the thing went like a bat outta hell. I can't wait to have a 5 speed and compound turbos in it.
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  #35  
Old November 5th, 2009, 05:29 AM
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Quite the coincidence. I have found a 6bt near by, and am considering. Weight seems to be 300# heavier than a 4bt, but is all at the forward end. And acknowledge lots of fab work.
I have also found a new 4.6 being put together, and have the chance for a little head massaging and cam as mentioned above. Keeping it all Rover is best resale for sure. And bolt in is nice. Will probably keep FI, as I have a 90 w/ the Edlebrock intake and carb w/ headers- nice enough, but miss the FI.
Still considering SBC- talk about displacement...... just hate not to go diesel?
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  #36  
Old November 5th, 2009, 12:35 PM
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Gen III or Gen IV GM is what I am thinking for myself and I am a dyed in the wool diesel addict. Everything I own is diesel or getting converted (FZJ80 getting 1HZ Toyota, 1969 VW Kombi getting 1.9TDI ALH, a couple VWs and 6BT Rover).
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  #37  
Old November 5th, 2009, 06:09 PM
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JL- What is the 6bt in? How was the install? Any thing to share- or should I assume the suggestion for SBC sums it up? Thanks
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  #38  
Old November 5th, 2009, 06:24 PM
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Why not just buy a real 3/4 or 1 ton pickup that will be a lot more comfortable, and do a much better job of pulling your junk around?
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  #39  
Old November 5th, 2009, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rover4x4
Why not just buy a real 3/4 or 1 ton pickup that will be a lot more comfortable, and do a much better job of pulling your junk around?
Not only that, I've got a Dodge 2500 to sell you! Ha ha! My turn to push vehicles!
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  #40  
Old November 5th, 2009, 07:10 PM
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In all seriousness, why try to cobble some Defender together to get it to do something it was never really meant to do? I mean I am all for throwing good money away and be "unique" but come on. Go down to the GMC dealership and get a real truck to do the job the right way.
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