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  #1  
Old February 11th, 2016, 04:59 PM
Hache
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Henry Lambert
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Engine swap options

I have a 2.5na. It's fine for daily driving but longer trips aren't fun.

My plan was to swap in a 200tdi but with the parts shortage I keep hearing about I'm now open to more routes.

In my head the options are:

300tdi but this could get expensive with new transmission reqd

Rover V8 - lots of parts and cheapish

LS - my favourite option but very pricey

Om617 - agricultural without being Rover

What would you do?
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  #2  
Old February 11th, 2016, 05:07 PM
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There is no 200tdi parts shortage.
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  #3  
Old February 11th, 2016, 05:24 PM
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There is no 200tdi parts shortage.
Ahh yes, the surplus of new 200tdi heads and injectors! I forgot about that.
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  #4  
Old February 11th, 2016, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hache View Post
I have a 2.5na. It's fine for daily driving but longer trips aren't fun.

My plan was to swap in a 200tdi but with the parts shortage I keep hearing about I'm now open to more routes.

In my head the options are:

300tdi but this could get expensive with new transmission reqd

Rover V8 - lots of parts and cheapish

LS - my favourite option but very pricey

Om617 - agricultural without being Rover

What would you do?
I researched all the same engine options with my 2.5na and always ended up back at the same answer. $$ per HP the LS swap is by far the best..

Sure you can find a used OM617 Mercedes motor with 185,000 miles on it for $300, but its gonna be about $3k for the adapters and accessories to make it work and you are still at 125hp...

300TDI is going to be about the same price overall as the LS swap but much less reliable and much less hp...

If it were me, I would search around on Craigslist and Car-Part.com until you find the perfect used low mileage LS motor and 6l80 out of a wrecked Silverado, Tahoe, Suburban, Escalade, etc. I paid $1400 for my LS from a 2012 Silverado with 30k miles and $900 for the tranny.

Just my 2 cents...
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  #5  
Old February 11th, 2016, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnsD90 View Post
Ahh yes, the surplus of new 200tdi heads and injectors! I forgot about that.
If in the rare chance that you destroy your head by running it really poorly, you can switch to a 300TDI head.
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  #6  
Old February 11th, 2016, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by JohnsD90 View Post
Ahh yes, the surplus of new 200tdi heads and injectors! I forgot about that.
Are those heads very prone to cracking or something? Most heads can be repaired by a good machine shop. I assume 200 Tdi injectors are like most other injectors and can be rebuilt.
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  #7  
Old February 11th, 2016, 06:05 PM
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Henry Lambert
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thanks all.

A toss up between the LS and 200tdi.
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  #8  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:08 PM
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with Gas as cheap as it is the Rover V8 with dual SU's isn't a bad ride. 75/80mph all day long... nothing much to break except may be a thermostat, oil change intervals 6000miles are fine.......
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  #9  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by 86Defend110 View Post
300TDI is going to be about the same price overall as the LS swap but much less reliable
Wow... I'd be interested in the definition of "reliable" as used in this opinion, or perhaps some factual data that backs up this statement.

Not everyone is chasing horsepower
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  #10  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:20 PM
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Jeff Labbé
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Isuzu 2.8 or 4bt? Still a viable option isn't it?
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  #11  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Mybluett View Post
Wow... I'd be interested in the definition of "reliable" as used in this opinion, or perhaps some factual data that backs up this statement.

Not everyone is chasing horsepower

Type this into your favorite search engine:

"300tdi cracked cylinder head"
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  #12  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 86Defend110 View Post
Type this into your favorite search engine:

"300tdi cracked cylinder head"

Can do the same for the LS oil pump, timing chain, pushrods, valve springs...

Of the 8 Tdi motors we replaced last year, none had cracked head issues.

The question is what is the definition of "reliable" in the context of this discussion?
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  #13  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:31 PM
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I have the OM617 swap in my truck. I think the engine is great, but at the end of the day it is still a 30+ year old engine with <150 hp. It burns oil, is leaky like a rover and smokes more than my old 2.5 NA. All that being said, I wasn't surprised by any of this and the OM617 was exactly what I wanted -- especially because the swap could be done in my home garage with no fabrication or modification

I would budget $4000 on top of the engine cost to do the swap right. You could drop it in for less but by the time you make all the ancillaries right you'll be at about $4k. I will consider all of this cost COMPLETELY worth it when this engine dies and I'm able to throw another one in with a weekend of work and less than $500. If I had bought a 200tdi and it died after 3 years I would be SOL.

. I would have definitely considered an LS swap if I had the time and space to complete it myself. I saw one at Uwharrie a year ago or so and it was super impressive. If I had done that swap I would be much more likely to throw the family in the 110 and head 45 minutes down the highway, drive 1.5 hours to the river or make a full-day's drive to an event. In my case, the OM617 swap still has some bugs to work out. Part of pulling a 'junk yard' engine is that once you start putting miles on it the little things start to need attention.
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  #14  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mybluett View Post
Can do the same for the LS oil pump, timing chain, pushrods, valve springs...

Of the 8 Tdi motors we replaced last year, none had cracked head issues.

The question is what is the definition of "reliable" in the context of this discussion?
Lets go with which motor will be less expensive to operate over its lifespan. Whether it is scheduled maintenance or something unexpected breaking. In my opinion the LS would be as parts are readily available and much cheaper here in the US compared to 300TDI parts.
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  #15  
Old February 11th, 2016, 07:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 86Defend110 View Post
Lets go with which motor will be less expensive to operate over its lifespan. Whether it is scheduled maintenance or something unexpected breaking. In my opinion the LS would be as parts are readily available and much cheaper here in the US compared to 300TDI parts.
Couldn't agree with you more on the cost to maintain any NAPA, Shucks, Pep-boys, etc.. supported engine being less expensive, and also faster/easier to return to running.
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  #16  
Old February 11th, 2016, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Mybluett View Post
Couldn't agree with you more on the cost to maintain any NAPA, Shucks, Pep-boys, etc.. supported engine being less expensive, and also faster/easier to return to running.
Why buy aftermarket parts for one of those engines when the Genuine parts are probably also cheap?
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  #17  
Old February 11th, 2016, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Mybluett View Post
Wow... I'd be interested in the definition of "reliable" as used in this opinion, or perhaps some factual data that backs up this statement.

Not everyone is chasing horsepower

Agreed
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  #18  
Old February 11th, 2016, 09:09 PM
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please where did you buy your engine and tranny at that price? i need it please
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  #19  
Old February 11th, 2016, 09:10 PM
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Don Bunnell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ontheway View Post
I have the OM617 swap in my truck. I think the engine is great, but at the end of the day it is still a 30+ year old engine with <150 hp. It burns oil, is leaky like a rover and smokes more than my old 2.5 NA. All that being said, I wasn't surprised by any of this and the OM617 was exactly what I wanted -- especially because the swap could be done in my home garage with no fabrication or modification

I would budget $4000 on top of the engine cost to do the swap right. You could drop it in for less but by the time you make all the ancillaries right you'll be at about $4k. I will consider all of this cost COMPLETELY worth it when this engine dies and I'm able to throw another one in with a weekend of work and less than $500. If I had bought a 200tdi and it died after 3 years I would be SOL.

. I would have definitely considered an LS swap if I had the time and space to complete it myself. I saw one at Uwharrie a year ago or so and it was super impressive. If I had done that swap I would be much more likely to throw the family in the 110 and head 45 minutes down the highway, drive 1.5 hours to the river or make a full-day's drive to an event. In my case, the OM617 swap still has some bugs to work out. Part of pulling a 'junk yard' engine is that once you start putting miles on it the little things start to need attention.
Well said and I totally agree.

For me and building a truck that is a ST and one that I am looking to bring off road I think the OM617 was a good move. I am hoping with some mods (IC, IP, Turbo) that it will really transform the feel like Scrubs has had with his.

If I had a 5 door SW that was hauling kids and used on road more I would really look into the LS.

For a HD trail rig a 4BT could be a good move. But that is merely based on internet reading.
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  #20  
Old February 11th, 2016, 09:11 PM
kang2222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 86Defend110 View Post
I researched all the same engine options with my 2.5na and always ended up back at the same answer. $$ per HP the LS swap is by far the best..

Sure you can find a used OM617 Mercedes motor with 185,000 miles on it for $300, but its gonna be about $3k for the adapters and accessories to make it work and you are still at 125hp...

300TDI is going to be about the same price overall as the LS swap but much less reliable and much less hp...

If it were me, I would search around on Craigslist and Car-Part.com until you find the perfect used low mileage LS motor and 6l80 out of a wrecked Silverado, Tahoe, Suburban, Escalade, etc. I paid $1400 for my LS from a 2012 Silverado with 30k miles and $900 for the tranny.

Just my 2 cents...


where did you buy the engine and tranny? please i need that kinda price hook up
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