Diesel Upgrade: 300TDi vs 2.8TGV - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Non-Technical Discussions > Misc. Chit-Chat


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old March 9th, 2007, 05:38 AM
smenzel's Avatar
smenzel
Status: Offline
Sandro
1967 Series IIA
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 330
Diesel Upgrade: 300TDi vs 2.8TGV

I'm running a 2.5l naturally aspirated diesel in my 67 Series IIA (LT77 + LT230). Who'd have thought a diesel would be soooo slow going up all the hills around here (Seattle area)? The thought of just a wee bit more umph up those hills has me thinking pretty seriously about either the 300TDi or 2.8TGV.

Anyway, I'm looking for some feedback about the two engines -- comparing pros and cons, that sort of thing. I had decided on the 2.8 until I heard that it had been discontinued. Now I'm wondering if I should look for a 300 instead for better support and possibly more aftermarket parts manufacturers. Dunno.

I realize that both of these engines use a serpintine belt and include power steering, will require mounting adjustments, etc. I can live with the belt and work around the power steering. As for the mounting adjustments, I'll just have to adjust the mounts.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old March 9th, 2007, 04:44 PM
xmod
Status: Offline
Jeremy/Sturgeon
97 NAS D90 ST
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 68
I have the same question. I wanted to install a 2.8 diesel and see that ECR is no longer doing any diesel conversions at all. I don't want to hijack the thread, but does anyone know of a shop that currently does a diesel install?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old March 9th, 2007, 04:49 PM
Talleyrand's Avatar
Talleyrand
Status: Offline
John
1998 Defender 110 CSW 300Tdi
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Queens, NYC, NY
Posts: 812
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by xmod
I have the same question. I wanted to install a 2.8 diesel and see that ECR is no longer doing any diesel conversions at all. I don't want to hijack the thread, but does anyone know of a shop that currently does a diesel install?
Try Mike Wesson at Britannica Restorations in Lennoxville, Quebec (though might be a bit inconvenient for you unless you want to take a trip up there!). He has installed both engines for people in the past. For a SWB Series truck I would think that the 300Tdi would have more than enough power to zip you around. 2.8 would be much more $$ and overkill for your needs, IMHO. But drop Mike a line: britrest at britrest dot com.

Cheers,
John
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old March 9th, 2007, 05:46 PM
xmod
Status: Offline
Jeremy/Sturgeon
97 NAS D90 ST
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 68
Thanks for the tip John. I think I've emailed them in the past.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old March 9th, 2007, 06:16 PM
Defender13's Avatar
Defender13
Status: Offline
Mike Lynch
1994 Defender 90 #1017
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Hartland, MI USA
Posts: 311
When did ECR throw in the towel on diesel conversions. I am still waiting for a return call from ECR regarding a project I am/was very serious about (a few emails and two phone calls and no return). I finally gave up and started to look elsewhere. I talked to Pendy and he gave me a bunch of great info. He'll be the guy once I figure out exactly what I want to do.
__________________
Mike Lynch

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old March 9th, 2007, 08:22 PM
huck1974's Avatar
huck1974
Status: Offline
shane cates
94 d90
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: springfield mo
Posts: 890
I'm going Isuzu. cheaper and better. can't wait to see the numbers on it this summer
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old March 9th, 2007, 08:50 PM
Overlander's Avatar
Overlander
Status: Offline
mark kellgren
in between D's in an 04 D2
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 6,531
Registry
Pendy installed my 2.8. Excellent work, highly recommend. (for off road use only of course!)
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old March 10th, 2007, 12:03 AM
JimC's Avatar
JimC
Status: Offline
Jim Cheney
NAS 110 #145
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Stuttgart, Germany
Posts: 7,154
Registry
I understand Brit Rest has "issues." Recently they were liquidating a bunch of stuff due to a serious lost-time injury. They might not even still be in business.

Unless you live on Nantucket, Pendy or Shane Ballensky are your best bets. You're going to get great work from either one, so its just a matter of who is available and whether you want to ship your truck to Kansas or California. Both of those guys have done work for me, and I'm 100% pleased with both of them. Not only was their work superior, I really enjoyed talking and doing business with them.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old March 10th, 2007, 12:19 AM
pendy's Avatar
pendy
Status: Offline
jim pendleton
89'd90
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: andover, ks usa
Posts: 2,341
I have a 200 tdi that would go nicely in your truck. Good fit for a series rig. Very good power/ecomomy.

JP
Outright or installed. Off road only.

Quote:
Originally Posted by smenzel
I'm running a 2.5l naturally aspirated diesel in my 67 Series IIA (LT77 + LT230). Who'd have thought a diesel would be soooo slow going up all the hills around here (Seattle area)? The thought of just a wee bit more umph up those hills has me thinking pretty seriously about either the 300TDi or 2.8TGV.

Anyway, I'm looking for some feedback about the two engines -- comparing pros and cons, that sort of thing. I had decided on the 2.8 until I heard that it had been discontinued. Now I'm wondering if I should look for a 300 instead for better support and possibly more aftermarket parts manufacturers. Dunno.

I realize that both of these engines use a serpintine belt and include power steering, will require mounting adjustments, etc. I can live with the belt and work around the power steering. As for the mounting adjustments, I'll just have to adjust the mounts.
__________________
legend in my own mind

Advice is only as good as the person applying it--
Don't make me give you bad advice!

Lemons or lemonaide, whatever your taste provides.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old March 10th, 2007, 02:20 PM
Buckon37s's Avatar
Buckon37s
Status: Offline
Buck
Re-Fendered 90
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Temecula, CA, USA
Posts: 3,376
Either engine you go with will feel like a rocket compared to what you have now. I think the most important factor is cost, what your comfortable paying. The 200 option may be the best bang for your buck with Pendy.
__________________
2009 King of the Hammers

BUCK Wild Racing
Driver: Me
Co-driver: Pat Quirk
Team 911

Rover Tracks
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PSC
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
DJ Safety
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
West Coast Rovers
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reel Driveline
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Made it further than half of the other guys, but the Hammers won.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old March 11th, 2007, 01:16 AM
Talleyrand's Avatar
Talleyrand
Status: Offline
John
1998 Defender 110 CSW 300Tdi
Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Queens, NYC, NY
Posts: 812
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimC
I understand Brit Rest has "issues." Recently they were liquidating a bunch of stuff due to a serious lost-time injury. They might not even still be in business.

Unless you live on Nantucket, Pendy or Shane Ballensky are your best bets. You're going to get great work from either one, so its just a matter of who is available and whether you want to ship your truck to Kansas or California. Both of those guys have done work for me, and I'm 100% pleased with both of them. Not only was their work superior, I really enjoyed talking and doing business with them.
Sounds like Pendy's offer is your best bet.

I should mention in all fairness to Mike Wesson that he is still in business, but possibly focusing now more on conversions/restorations of complete vehicles to sell on. Last I saw at his place, he had a nice Td5 Defender 110 CSW halfway finished. Mike was selling off his parts inventory because he decided that what with people ordering parts direct from the UK more and more, it was just too expensive to try to keep inventory up etc - not economically viable any more. Anyway, no one on this board should think that his business is over, under a cloud, etc.

Cheers,
John
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old March 11th, 2007, 11:54 AM
Red90's Avatar
Red90
Status: Online
John B.
1991 Defender 90, 200TDI
Site Team
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Calgary
Posts: 9,237
Registry
You could also consider a 200TDI. If you get a Defender version, it is a straight bolt in. I just did mine last weekend. Around 12 hours by myself. No modifications needed.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old March 11th, 2007, 11:11 PM
headdamage's Avatar
headdamage
Status: Offline
Andrew
exmod 90 2.5na and a 93/RRC 200tdi
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Yellowknife NWT
Posts: 227
knowing the truck in question I'd sugest a 200TDI or 19J.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old March 16th, 2007, 09:35 PM
smenzel's Avatar
smenzel
Status: Offline
Sandro
1967 Series IIA
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 330
Thanks for the feedback. I'm not sure anyone really answered my question. Lots of pointers in another direction which, while confusing my decision, I do appreciate the thought.

The 200TDI option is an ok idea. I had considered it previously but my concerns, again, are longevity of parts availability. No one seemed to address this in their suggestions. I plan on driving this truck for another twenty to thirty years.

Perhaps I didn't explain this very well. I have been working with a local Land Rover mechanic on the entire restoration of this vehicle. One source. He has graciously allowed me to help and learn about the truck as it is restored. I've been a part of the entire decision process and involved with the entire restoration process. While I don't know as much about the truck as my mechanic, I do know a fair bit more than if someone had just built and shipped it to me. Did I mention I plan on driving this truck for a long time?

So ... I'm still looking for engine ideas. The 200TDI is an option but please understand that the question I'm asking is for comparisons between the engines (200TDI vs 300TDI vs 2.8GTV), longevity issues (particularly of parts) and sourcing the engine. My apologies but I already have an installer.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old March 17th, 2007, 09:42 AM
huck1974's Avatar
huck1974
Status: Offline
shane cates
94 d90
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: springfield mo
Posts: 890
do a search for discotech industries. He carries a few diesel options in full kit form for around $7500. Hopefully that helps a little.

He is also a big proponent to the Isuzu swap because of parts availability in the US. He did have TDI kits and some other stuff last time I talked to him.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old March 17th, 2007, 10:51 AM
Overlander's Avatar
Overlander
Status: Offline
mark kellgren
in between D's in an 04 D2
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 6,531
Registry
The 2.8 is a vast improvement over the 300tdi, and I have no concerns on parts availability, given that it shares many components, and almost all common service items, with the 300tdi. My only concern on my upgrade was the very small margin of safety between the max torque output of the 2.8 and the max torque rating of the R380. I think the R380 is rated something like 5 or 10 nmover the 2.8 output. What let's me sleep at night is that the previous owner of my truck upgraded to the "L" series R380, which has the needed improvements. I don't think the LT77 can handle the 2.8 torque, which would leave you with the 300tdi (IMHO).

Also keep in mind, that while everyone with 300tdi's quote 25-30 mpg as the norm, I have been getting a consistent 18-20 mpg, probably due to the vastly increased power output. if economy is a factor for you, then bear that in mind.

Regardless, I love my 2.8.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old March 17th, 2007, 01:06 PM
Buckon37s's Avatar
Buckon37s
Status: Offline
Buck
Re-Fendered 90
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Temecula, CA, USA
Posts: 3,376
300TDi's don't really have that great of gas milage either. Your honestly looking at 20-23 mpg. Less with a really heavy foot.

Like I said earlier, it depends on your budget. If you have the coin, get the 2.8, if not, get the 300. The HP difference is small, but I think the cost difference is smaller now too. As far as life expectancy, nobody really knows. The 2.8 could last forever, or die early, just like a 300. Hope that helps.
__________________
2009 King of the Hammers

BUCK Wild Racing
Driver: Me
Co-driver: Pat Quirk
Team 911

Rover Tracks
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PSC
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
DJ Safety
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
West Coast Rovers
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reel Driveline
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Made it further than half of the other guys, but the Hammers won.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old March 19th, 2007, 07:14 AM
Westiia
Status: Offline
Alex West
1969 Series IIA 88" ST
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Peterborough UK
Posts: 28
300tdi wont fit your gearbox without swapping the rear cover off a 200tdi. 200tdi will drop straight in and wont be a serpentine belt so you can get round power steering issues. Its pretty much identical to a 300 in terms of power torque and design.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old March 19th, 2007, 08:58 AM
ECR's Avatar
ECR
Status: Offline
East Coast Rover Co.
Just Defenders, nothing else.
D-90 Source Vendor
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Rockland, ME, USA
Posts: 4,614
Quote:
Originally Posted by xmod
I have the same question. I wanted to install a 2.8 diesel and see that ECR is no longer doing any diesel conversions at all.
What our web site says and what we do at the shop are sometmes 2 different things. EPA and DOT watch our web site just like fans do, and with EPA cracking down on shops that install non-EPA approved diesels (numerous fines handed out recently) the web site had to change. If you want to ask about a diesel call or email us.

Follow-up Post:

[QUOTE=Defender13 I am still waiting for a return call from ECR regarding a project I am/was very serious about (a few emails and two phone calls and no return). .[/QUOTE]

Craig, I have a file on you with our emails back and forth and you sent me your list a few weeks ago. Pendy can set you up and we wish you the best, but if I have been sending you emails how can you say that you go "no return"? Best of luck with your project.
__________________
Email:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I do not check PMs. Call or email if you need something.

ECR is not a parts source. We are not in the mail order business.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old March 19th, 2007, 10:05 AM
Gore Ranger's Avatar
Gore Ranger
Status: Offline
Jeff
1989 RRC
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 536
Smile

I hope the EPA and DOT dont watch this site! :-)
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Non-Technical Discussions > Misc. Chit-Chat

Tags
300tdi, diesel, tdi

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Bypass oil filtering on a diesel 300tdi or 2.8TGV? Chaucer Misc. Chit-Chat 1 July 11th, 2006 06:54 PM
Ex-MOD 2.5 diesel 90 EndlessEarth4WD Misc. Chit-Chat 18 January 26th, 2006 01:34 PM
300tdi diesel fueling control solenoid Chris Cox For Sale - Parts 1 January 2nd, 2005 07:22 PM
Diesel Conversion Experiences JimC Defender Technical Discussions 10 December 13th, 2004 05:22 PM
Mounting 3-Link Crossmember on 300tdi chassis Chris Cox Defender Technical Discussions 4 March 10th, 2004 02:12 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:43 PM.


Copyright