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  #41  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:20 PM
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Just look how well the immigration system works in order to allow foreign students to benefit the country... Where else in the world can a foreign student come here, go to school under subsidies under one name, study programs that encourage socialism, overstay your visa, change your name and then go on to totally rape the American system for your own self gain and be allowed to call yourself the president... And not have to show anything to disprove any of it...

------ Follow up post added February 24th, 2015 01:21 PM ------

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Originally Posted by vasily View Post
Haha yup.
When was the last time any of you were there..??...you do know Australia is a different place to Austria..right..??
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  #42  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:29 PM
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Agreed that programs can be abused ... but don't throw the baby out with the bath water ... the H1-B program brings masses of talent into the US that fills skills gaps and directly contributes to the growing economy. The root cause of your hypothetical example is criminal behavior by the LLC creators facilitating unqualified people onto a program. They should be held accountable for their actions and the cost of remediation, which includes finding and deporting the people that illegally entered the country. Every person I've met on a H1-B is acutely aware that it can be taken away at any time either by immigration or loss of employment. They spend years ( 10-15 is not uncommon ) navigating the system with the constant potential of deportation to secure residency and citizenship.
We will have to agree to disagree on this one. The H1-B is a successful policy but is (inadvertently) flawed by actually speeding up the offshoring of jobs. Except for Microsoft, the top 10 companies that request the most H1-B work are facilitating their outsourcing. Look at the significant growth of their offshoring operations and where their "world" HQs are located. Look up Infosys for one example (fourth highest number of H1-B visas). Thankfully the Gov't nailed them for a fine of $34M. But at the end of the day, still no changes were made.
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  #43  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the rover shop View Post
Just look how well the immigration system works in order to allow foreign students to benefit the country... Where else in the world can a foreign student come here, go to school under subsidies under one name, study programs that encourage socialism, overstay your visa, change your name and then go on to totally rape the American system for your own self gain and be allowed to call yourself the president... And not have to show anything to disprove any of it...

------ Follow up post added February 24th, 2015 01:21 PM ------



When was the last time any of you were there..??...you do know Australia is a different place to Austria..right..??
DAMN! Shayne does have a mastery of recent American History!
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  #44  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the rover shop View Post
Just look how well the immigration system works in order to allow foreign students to benefit the country... Where else in the world can a foreign student come here, go to school under subsidies under one name, study programs that encourage socialism, overstay your visa, change your name and then go on to totally rape the American system for your own self gain and be allowed to call yourself the president... And not have to show anything to disprove any of it...

------ Follow up post added February 24th, 2015 01:21 PM ------



When was the last time any of you were there..??...you do know Australia is a different place to Austria..right..??

Yeah! Thanks for Hitler you damn Kiwi!
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  #45  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:33 PM
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This escalated quickly.
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  #46  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:34 PM
the rover shop
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I used to like you mark (overlander) ...nah, just kidding..lol..
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  #47  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
genetically pure US born white guys
For all of our enlightenment, can you please further define "genetically pure?" And explain to the rest of us what NAACP has to do with H1-B or ISIS?
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  #48  
Old February 24th, 2015, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Ren Ching View Post
For all of our enlightenment, can you please further define "genetically pure?" And explain to the rest of us what NAACP has to do with H1-B or ISIS?

5 years from now they'll come up with the definition! And I won't be one of the 7 that's for sure! We all need to get onboard the inequality train.

As for NAACP, Al Sharpton is going to chime in at somepoint about the protection of our disenfranchised muslim brothers in Syria and how US drones are oppressing them. It'll never end!

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  #49  
Old February 24th, 2015, 02:08 PM
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Originally Posted by down_shift View Post
We will have to agree to disagree on this one. The H1-B is a flawed policy that is actually speeding up the offshoring of jobs. Except for Microsoft, the top 10 companies that request the most H1-B work are facilitating their outsourcing. Look at the significant growth of their offshoring operations and where their "world" HQs are located. Look up Infosys for one example (fourth highest number of H1-B visas). Thankfully the Gov't nailed them for a fine of $34M. But at the end of the day, still no changes were made.

Infosys were abusing B-1 visa's to avoid paying US taxes and also because of the cost and complexity of getting H1-Bs'

see this link from NY Law Journal ..http://dscreationsglore.homestead.co...le_1_22_14.pdf

H1-B is an on-shoring program that ensures work product is performed in the US and contributes to the US economy. If H1-B's weren't available then the work product would need to be moved to a location where the skills could be sourced.

Perhaps if the 'Job creators' in this focused on building US jobs market there wouldn't be such a healthy market for off shoring.

Offshoring exists because there is a demand and companies fill that demand.
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  #50  
Old February 24th, 2015, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by down_shift View Post
Look up Infosys for one example (fourth highest number of H1-B visas).
They're up to number one now, I think - crazy volume.
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  #51  
Old February 24th, 2015, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
Infosys were abusing B-1 visa's to avoid paying US taxes and also because of the cost and complexity of getting H1-Bs'

see this link from NY Law Journal ..http://dscreationsglore.homestead.co...le_1_22_14.pdf

H1-B is an on-shoring program that ensures work product is performed in the US and contributes to the US economy. If H1-B's weren't available then the work product would need to be moved to a location where the skills could be sourced.

Perhaps if the 'Job creators' in this focused on building US jobs market there wouldn't be such a healthy market for off shoring.

Offshoring exists because there is a demand and companies fill that demand.
Great link, thanks for posting. It think it only perpetuates my point. The opening sentence says "Eight out of the top 10 companies that filed a request with U.S. Department of Labor in fiscal year 2013 to temporality hire a foreign professional were either Indian IT companies or IT companies that did the bulk of their development work in India."
How can anyone argue that this "on-shoring program" policy is not flawed? The policy opens the doors to off shore our technology and the jobs that go with it (of course at a lower labor rate).
Good statement about the job creators focusing on building a US market. For the last several years, there are more annual STEM graduates domestically than STEM job openings. The opposite was true 15 years ago when the H-1B policy was created to correct that deficit during the explosion of the high tech industry. It is time we start paring it down and recruit and train domestically.
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  #52  
Old February 24th, 2015, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by down_shift View Post
Great link, thanks for posting. It think it only perpetuates my point. The opening sentence says "Eight out of the top 10 companies that filed a request with U.S. Department of Labor in fiscal year 2013 to temporality hire a foreign professional were either Indian IT companies or IT companies that did the bulk of their development work in India."
How can anyone argue that this "on-shoring program" policy is not flawed? The policy opens the doors to off shore our technology and the jobs that go with it (of course at a lower labor rate).
Good statement about the job creators focusing on building a US market. For the last several years, there are more annual STEM graduates domestically than STEM job openings. The opposite was true 15 years ago when the H-1B policy was created to correct that deficit during the explosion of the high tech industry. It is time we start paring it down and recruit and train domestically.
Ha! We're all driving Indian cars! The only question at this point is in 10 years, will the US be a province of India or China.

But what does any of this have to do with Defenders? Oh wait, they're going to be made in India... Wait, what are we talking about?

I just hope I can get a New Zealand H1-B when all the jobs in the US are gone since I'm blocked from Australia. And I was really looking forward to meat cakes..

------ Follow up post added February 24th, 2015 03:10 PM ------

I was wondering if all enthusiast forums go this off topic, so I went over to IH8MUD for the very first time to see what Yota guys talk about in their chit chat section. Conclusion, they talk about cars and trucks. I didn't see any politics in the first 4 pages of threads. Interesting.

They must have a private mud pit as well...or they don't.
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  #53  
Old February 24th, 2015, 03:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
Ha! We're all driving Indian cars! The only question at this point is in 10 years, will the US be a province of India or China.

But what does any of this have to do with Defenders? Oh wait, they're going to be made in India... Wait, what are we talking about?

I just hope I can get a New Zealand H1-B when all the jobs in the US are gone since I'm blocked from Australia. And I was really looking forward to meat cakes..
Provence of India or China.... LOL - Obama worked on that very issue last month: H-1B Visas: Obama’s Visit Brings Hope for India’s Skilled Workers - India Real Time - WSJ
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  #54  
Old February 24th, 2015, 03:12 PM
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Provence of India or China.... LOL - Obama worked on that very issue last month: H-1B Visas: Obamaís Visit Brings Hope for Indiaís Skilled Workers - India Real Time - WSJ

AHHHHH!! Now I get what he meant by HOPE and CHANGE!
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  #55  
Old February 24th, 2015, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
since I'm blocked from Australia. And I was really looking forward to meat cakes..

------ Follow up post added February 24th, 2015 03:10 PM ------

I was wondering if all enthusiast forums go this off topic, so I went over to IH8MUD for the very first time to see what Yota guys talk about in their chit chat section. Conclusion, they talk about cars and trucks. I didn't see any politics in the first 4 pages of threads. Interesting.

They must have a private mud pit as well...or they don't.
It's meat PIES goddammit....

And politics is more of an intellectual discussion than the IH8MUD guys can handle..
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  #56  
Old February 24th, 2015, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by the rover shop View Post
It's meat PIES goddammit....

And politics is more of an intellectual discussion than the IH8MUD guys can handle..
We finally agree on something! Let's capitalize on that and discuss the Keystone pipepline!

Hey, for the record, I'm all about going deep, deep down whatever political rathole everyone wants to pontificate about, as long as we're not talking about that bitch Mrs. P
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  #57  
Old February 24th, 2015, 04:23 PM
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When was the last time any of you were there..??...you do know Australia is a different place to Austria..right..??
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  #58  
Old February 24th, 2015, 04:46 PM
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Funny I looked at the first post a few days ago now its up to 3 pages! lol...

correction...not a few days...YESTERDAY!
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  #59  
Old February 24th, 2015, 05:56 PM
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yeah I'm off for a day...and this...

Dunno where to start but...SMac we will have to agree to disagree...but Dave nailed my response - he got it.

But nowwe are on to a HBO-1 debate and as an ex-partner for one of the largest outsourcing consulting companies in the world I actually know a thing or ten about that topic.....

Politics not so much...just that it all sux in America - we need to both in a big bloody blender
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  #60  
Old February 24th, 2015, 07:00 PM
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As with most Gov't programs, H1-B visas can be abused. Hypothetical example here in NOVA. LLC is created. A tech staffing shop opens under the LLC. The LLC also starts acquiring distressed ethnic restaurants in 2nd and 3rd tier shopping centers ...
Seriously? Have you actually tried to get a H-1B for an employee? It's next to impossible.

In 2007, I had the backing of my medium-sized tech company employer to hire a French citizen for my team and get him a H-1B. This guy was (and still is...) at the top of his game. Truly one of the most talented software developers in the world for his particular niche. We flew him over for an interview and the team loved him and I made him an offer on the spot (visa-contingent) and he accepted. My company hired an expensive immigration attorney in Texas to do the visa processing for the lottery. He did not win. We tried again and spent another $15K with the attorneys to try to get him an O-1 visa ("Person with extraordinary ability in the sciences, arts, education, business, or athletics") and were rejected again. We gave up.

This was someone who would have immigrated and made a six-figure salary, paid his taxes, and who would have filled a critical need for a fast-growing company--a job that was next to impossible to find stateside because there were only about 10 guys who were experienced with this niche in the US. I don't know if it was jobs protectionism or post-9/11 immigration fears but I will always remember this story whenever someone complains about immigration.
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