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  #21  
Old September 11th, 2015, 12:23 AM
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Good luck...stick it out.

The best thing about management is the people...the worst thing about management is...you guessed it...the people.

I work at a company that is 50% engineers, thank goodness I don't manage any of them, great bunch. Too complex for me.
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  #22  
Old September 11th, 2015, 12:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grover View Post
I typically don't ask for advise or thoughts outside of Rover repairs but what the hell...

I recently moved up in ranks from an engineer (15 years) to engineering management and I'm finding the transition difficult. Yes, more $$$, but more headaches too.
I thought it would be better for my family, less travel, more flexible schedule, but I do not get the sense of accomplishment I did when I was doing engineering work.
I have a masters of science in engineering and have been technical my whole career. I have very little management experience. Managing people problems is so much different than managing technical problems.
I guess I could just work on my Defender to get my technical fix...lol

Any of you gone through this?
Congratulations. It sounds like you're just feeling out of your comfort zone a little. It's a big change to go from one function to another. I would suggest a few things that may help. To regain that 'sense of accomplishment', rethink about what you consider an accomplishment. It will help. Being able to manage/lead others, especially those you know can be difficult. Just be sure everyone is clear on what the expectations and goals are. Do not assume anything, communication is key. Having a manager with prior intimate knowledge ie:worked their way up the ranks, is a far better leader imo than someone who is an off the street hire to fill a management position. Consider yourself an asset because I am very sure many others do too. In my experience some of the worst managers are the ones with no clue other than that they had the job title "manager" They did not get their teams respect and usually wouldn't last. At the end of the day you have to decide if this is the job you want and are fulfilled doing. There is the rub. If you became an engineer because you love it...well, maybe consider taking on a side project to keep those juices flowing. Maybe mentoring others and you may consider finding a mentor of your own as well. Don't take things too OTT seriously unless necessary, don't turn into a douche, don't overthink and relax! You are your own worst critic. Hang in there...

One of the weirdest conversations I had with an engineer:

him: That guy is terrible!! He doesn't know what the heck he's doing!! **rant, rant, rant**
me: He's not that bad. Jeeze, give him a break. He'll be ok. Oh and btw, he's an engineer also.
him: AN ENGINEER!?! He's untrainable!!
me: (thinking) Is that a statement or a question?
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  #23  
Old September 11th, 2015, 05:53 AM
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One of the weirdest conversations I had with an engineer:

him: That guy is terrible!! He doesn't know what the heck he's doing!! **rant, rant, rant**
me: He's not that bad. Jeeze, give him a break. He'll be ok. Oh and btw, he's an engineer also.
him: AN ENGINEER!?! He's untrainable!!
me: (thinking) Is that a statement or a question? [/QUOTE]

Carmen, that is signature material!! But not for my wife's eyes ;-)
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  #24  
Old September 11th, 2015, 07:31 AM
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NYT article with some thoughts on this

Doesn't contain all the answers but at least challenges the "more is better" paradigm that drives our climb up the corporate ladder. It's short and worth a read:

Rising to Your Level of Misery at Work
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  #25  
Old September 11th, 2015, 07:58 AM
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Having made similar transformation, I agree with the article- well put actually! I think Will H is a great example of this as well given his recent pro bono case work.... Serving others with no expectation of return is quite liberating to the work a day world in which we live.
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  #26  
Old September 11th, 2015, 12:06 PM
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Yeah being a supervisor isn't for everyone. Like the article pointed out, I followed that path. Even went to b-school to get an MBA and management training, blah blah blah. At the end of the day, absolutely hated it. Ironically b school taught me above all to value my worth. The time I spent chasing after direct reports and co-workers, and spent in meeting after meeting, I could've been at home or golfing or fixing one of my pain in the but vehicles, namely doing something that gave me happiness.
I must say. I like managing me though. I resigned from management and run my own businesses that contracts out to my previous employer. so look into being your own boss if you want to grow and be independent but don't want to necessarily join the larger corporate American management hell.
Good luck
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  #27  
Old September 11th, 2015, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by josh-man View Post
You would miss the big heavy' anyway dave if you were stuck behind a desk!!
Exactly. I love my job and supervisory duties would just screw it up. Besides that would end my goal of eating lunch with as many D-Source members as I can before I retire.
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  #28  
Old September 11th, 2015, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javelinadave View Post
Exactly. I love my job and supervisory duties would just screw it up. Besides that would end my goal of eating lunch with as many D-Source members as I can before I retire.
Dave,
You are a jet pilot. I think we would all like your job.
Just saying....
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  #29  
Old September 11th, 2015, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Uncle Douglas View Post
Dave,
You are a jet pilot. I think we would all like your job.
Just saying....
Exactly my point. Why screw up a good thing. If I wanted to herd cats I would buy some land and ranch tabbies or calicos. There is a lot to be said for got to work, do your stuff and go home.
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  #30  
Old September 12th, 2015, 01:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rovertrader View Post
Carmen, that is signature material!! But not for my wife's eyes ;-)
You bet. I thought it was an interesting conversation. I have several engineers in my family, Dad being one of them. He retired from his co. as a manager. He/they like to tinker manually or mentally on stuff - you know, challenge themselves and fix things that may or may not be broken lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by WG_moots View Post
Doesn't contain all the answers but at least challenges the "more is better" paradigm that drives our climb up the corporate ladder. It's short and worth a read:

Rising to Your Level of Misery at Work
Quote:
Originally Posted by rovertrader View Post
Having made similar transformation, I agree with the article- well put actually! I think Will H is a great example of this as well given his recent pro bono case work.... Serving others with no expectation of return is quite liberating to the work a day world in which we live.
That's a good article. I'm sure many people have had similar experiences and then epiphany. I had mine when I was in my early 30s. The last line he wrote made me giggle:

"So cheer up, kvetchers. Relief is as close as the kindness you show to others. Build your cathedral. And for God’s sake, stop drinking so much."

There is so much truth in that...maybe that's why I'm such a lightweight drinker...
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  #31  
Old September 14th, 2015, 05:55 PM
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I'm also a jet pilot and I LOVE my job!!!

I'm with you Dave. In the past Carrie tried to get me to start up the management ladder. Eventually, she made friends with the Chief Pilot's wife. Bless that woman, she clearly explained that the phone never stops ringing, he gets no personal time off, he never travels (except to headquarters for meetings which add at least 2 travel days from Guam) and loses a lot of vacation time.

Carrie finally understood just how good we have it.

By the way, I'm going to 787 training on October 15. I'm VERY excited!

Mike

Quote:
Originally Posted by javelinadave View Post
Exactly my point. Why screw up a good thing. If I wanted to herd cats I would buy some land and ranch tabbies or calicos. There is a lot to be said for got to work, do your stuff and go home.
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  #32  
Old September 14th, 2015, 09:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GuamPilot View Post
I'm also a jet pilot and I LOVE my job!!! I'm with you Dave. In the past Carrie tried to get me to start up the management ladder. Eventually, she made friends with the Chief Pilot's wife. Bless that woman, she clearly explained that the phone never stops ringing, he gets no personal time off, he never travels (except to headquarters for meetings which add at least 2 travel days from Guam) and loses a lot of vacation time. Carrie finally understood just how good we have it. By the way, I'm going to 787 training on October 15. I'm VERY excited! Mike
I bet you love the job more now that Jeffy boy Smisek is outta here.

I've noticed a big change in morale. I just hope the new CEO is more like Gordon Bethune.

What ever became of Phil Webber?
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  #33  
Old September 14th, 2015, 09:54 PM
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My wife is a trolley dolly aka Flight Attendant and was super excited about the Smisek news
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  #34  
Old September 14th, 2015, 10:12 PM
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Crandall and his yield management was the man.
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  #35  
Old September 14th, 2015, 11:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy View Post
My wife is a trolley dolly aka Flight Attendant and was super excited about the Smisek news
Ironically, the Smisek departure occurred on my 28 year anniversary with the company. We had a big burger burn the following day to celebrate.
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  #36  
Old September 15th, 2015, 08:30 AM
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Most Continental employees were sad to see Mr. Bethune leave.

I have not talked to a single person who is sorry to see Mr. Smisek go.

Mike
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  #37  
Old September 15th, 2015, 09:02 AM
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The problem with most managers is that they are managers and lack the people and management skills for their job.
The fact that you recognize it is not the utopia position means you can seek the training you need or leave management to step into a technical role where you are happier.

A lot of managers of average intelligence think they are so much smarter than everyone else that they can be seen through by anyone with common sense who recognizes they have no idea what they are doing.
An example is they hire and force out the wrong people and in the long run add no real value with an over negative effect on the organization they so smugly climb the ladder in!

The above describes a lot of the people I've had the displeasure to work for over the years.
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  #38  
Old September 16th, 2015, 09:12 PM
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I competely lost track of Phil Weber after he left Guam, maybe 15 years ago.

Doing a little searching, I see he retired from the airline, but I don't know when. I sent him a note asking what he is up to.

Mike

Quote:
Originally Posted by LuisC View Post
I bet you love the job more now that Jeffy boy Smisek is outta here.

I've noticed a big change in morale. I just hope the new CEO is more like Gordon Bethune.

What ever became of Phil Webber?
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  #39  
Old September 17th, 2015, 12:17 AM
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I competely lost track of Phil Weber after he left Guam, maybe 15 years ago. Doing a little searching, I see he retired from the airline, but I don't know when. I sent him a note asking what he is up to. Mike
I knew Phil when he was flying Swearingen Metroliners for Britt Airways. He had several nicknames. Fast Phil, Redline Weber, and Bird Slayer Weber after he landed on 165 birds sitting on the runway.
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