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  #81  
Old June 25th, 2016, 11:25 AM
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https://fullfact.org/europe/our-eu-m...ee-55-million/

The actual number that UK pays per week is about 163 million pounds, but this changes on a yearly basis. The 350 number comes from the "raw" pre-rebate payments, etc, etc.... And it too is a number that changes from year to year.

Also, this being a referendum, it is basically a vote by the people to instruct their government to do something specific. The details of how that is done are yet to be worked out. (Correct me if I'm wrong if you're from the UK, but that's the way I understand it.)

I maintain that the reaction to this vote, by the UK government, but most especially by the EU, is what is really important. I bet the EU is going to take punitive measures instead of attempting to work with the UK for some future relationship that leaves them independent, but allows all to continue to benefit from trade... that's the way I'd do it, but I'm not an EU bureaucrat living fat off the membership fees.... so.......
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  #82  
Old June 25th, 2016, 11:41 AM
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Mike,

Best wishes for your weekend sir and if/when we ever meet in-person, it would be my pleasure to shake your hand.
I look forward to shaking your hand and will offer to buy you an adult beverage of your choice!

In a few minutes I'm walking out my door to drive my '88 110 to Mt. Rose, Nevada. I'm already behind schedule so my continuing participation in additional points will need to wait. I hope you agree using our beloved Defenders is more important.

Mike
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  #83  
Old June 25th, 2016, 11:56 AM
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Raub,

With regard to your questions:

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So Will I guess what you are saying is that because the vote didn't go in favor of world government/German rule the vote should be nullified?
No, sir this is actually not what I am saying. The vote should stand. I think that there is a lot to be said for this vote. However, bear in mind that the referendum does not carry with it any legal effect whatsoever. There is no legal requirement that Parliament move to withdraw the UK from the EU as the referendum was not written to include a legal trigger (see article below):

http://blogs.ft.com/david-allen-gree...te-for-brexit/

In this sense, the vote was merely intended to be advisory. But, it now appears that many were confused as to the issue being voted upon. And, that is a problem. Giving the vote legal effect would be like asking everyone in the UK to sign a contract but then not everyone first reading the contract carefully to understand what they were signing. Does this happen in real life? All the time! But, not in voting to displace one's country. I submit to you that such needs to be taken into account.

Clearly there are those in the UK who take issue with the current system. And, in that sense, most will agree that there needs to be reform of some sort. What that is, I couldn't say. Having stated the above, the positions of the German government and other world governments is, quite frankly, irrelevant.

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If the numbers were reversed and the remain side won by the same margin would you still be calling to change the rules of the vote after the fact? I bet not.
I'm sorry to report that you're wager would be a losing one sir. I am in favor of a 2/3 majority vote provision regardless of what side of the issue I may happen to fall on. If 2/3 of the UK public voted to leave, then I would be obliged to support that decision (granted I'm a US citizen, so take that for what you will). In my opinion though, this matter requires a higher level of commitment from the citizens of the UK than a simple majority is capable of delivering. For further explanation, I will refer you to my reply to Mike above.
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  #84  
Old June 25th, 2016, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by GuamPilot View Post
I look forward to shaking your hand and will offer to buy you an adult beverage of your choice!

In a few minutes I'm walking out my door to drive my '88 110 to Mt. Rose, Nevada. I'm already behind schedule so my continuing participation in additional points will need to wait. I hope you agree using our beloved Defenders is more important.

Mike
Mike,

Agreed x 2 sir! Thanks and chat again soon!
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  #85  
Old June 25th, 2016, 05:50 PM
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  #86  
Old June 25th, 2016, 07:00 PM
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Quote: "who the hell is Obama to tell another country to vote to be ruled by unelected bureaucrats in a different country."

Amen brother. Amen.
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  #87  
Old June 25th, 2016, 08:18 PM
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She was right.
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  #88  
Old June 25th, 2016, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Willh View Post
But, it now appears that many were confused as to the issue being voted upon. And, that is a problem. Giving the vote legal effect would be like asking everyone in the UK to sign a contract but then not everyone first reading the contract carefully to understand what they were signing. Does this happen in real life? All the time! But, not in voting to displace one's country. I submit to you that such needs to be taken into account.

Clearly there are those in the UK who take issue with the current system. And, in that sense, most will agree that there needs to be reform of some sort.

you just described Obamacare.
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  #89  
Old June 25th, 2016, 09:10 PM
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  #90  
Old June 25th, 2016, 10:06 PM
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My favorite Brexit
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  #91  
Old June 26th, 2016, 04:22 AM
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Jason,
I totally agree with much you have said, however I never said nor implied that migrants were scumbags - I said foreign criminals were scumbags as are own home grown variety.

As for foreign workers without doubt the UK needs them, however we don't need Big Issue sellers, Romainian beggars, Hand car wash sites etc these don't pay taxes but do use the NHS to treat everything from Cancer to Births and HIV/AIDS.

We just need to be able to say who get to work here much the same as the US,Canada,and OZ.

Yes things will be difficult for quite a while and as a steelworker I may well be a turkey voting for xmas however all said and done this had to be done.

In my humble opinion many UK politicians on all sides are self serving hipporcrates with their snouts in the EU trough, my own countryman Neil Kinnock and clan spring to mind these people will undoubtedly cause problems in the future.
That is without the pain that the other leaders in the EU will impose on the UK for daring to take their ball and go home.

This of course will give the French a greater shout at the EU table, the Spanish will create more problems over Gibraltar and expect the Argentinians to start squeeling next

Interesting times ahead
Regards all
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  #92  
Old June 26th, 2016, 08:29 AM
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Brexit; just in case the current elitist arrogance of the 'civilized' inhabitants of Europe had you losing track of how two world wars started there in the past century.

I do so love talking to Europeans about how messed up America is, and then stuff like this happens and you realize that as much of a shit show as America is, at least we doing put on the appearance of being something else.
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  #93  
Old June 26th, 2016, 10:20 AM
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I just want JuBExit to happen. That's Justin Bieber leaving the US permanently. Can someone tell me who to vote for to make that happen?
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  #94  
Old June 26th, 2016, 11:09 AM
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I just want JuBExit to happen. That's Justin Bieber leaving the US permanently. Can someone tell me who to vote for to make that happen?
Hillary ... ;-)
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  #95  
Old June 26th, 2016, 11:43 AM
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Hillary ... ;-)
I want compelling proof that Hillary will deliver. She hasn't delivered for African Americans in her 30 year career. We need a real color blind, prosperous and Bieber free America.
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  #96  
Old June 26th, 2016, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
I just want JuBExit to happen. That's Justin Bieber leaving the US permanently. Can someone tell me who to vote for to make that happen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
Hillary ... ;-)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Overlander View Post
I want compelling proof that Hillary will deliver. She hasn't delivered for African Americans in her 30 year career. We need a real color blind, prosperous and Bieber free America.
Why do I think that Hillary's limo driver is instructed to only play Bieber music and that she wears a Belieber t-shirt under her..... whatever you call what she wears..... pant suit thingy?

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  #97  
Old June 26th, 2016, 12:22 PM
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Trump would def sort it out; he's already ready to deport all kinds of other folks-what's a Canadian to add to the mix? Hell, he might accidentally just go to war with Canada early on just because he's disoriented and embracing his ready, fire, aim mantra.
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  #98  
Old June 26th, 2016, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by javelinadave View Post

Why do I think that Hillary's limo driver is instructed to only play Bieber music and that she wears a Belieber t-shirt under her..... whatever you call what she wears..... pant suit thingy?
In Iraq, all the Arabs wore the dishdash which we (US combat soldiers) referred to as the "man dress". whatever hillary wears is the opposite of that. may I propose "she pants" until a more suitable (pardon the pun) is brought forth?
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  #99  
Old June 26th, 2016, 02:03 PM
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In Iraq, all the Arabs wore the dishdash which we (US combat soldiers) referred to as the "man dress". whatever hillary wears is the opposite of that. may I propose "she pants" until a more suitable (pardon the pun) is brought forth?
Who wore it better?
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  #100  
Old June 26th, 2016, 02:10 PM
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Who wore it better?
well, i dont care what side you're on. Hillary looks rediculous in that panted tent getup she sports everywhere. Its like a science fiction outfit.

So even Arab men walking down the street in their man-dresses holding hands look better.
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