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  #61  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Red90 View Post
What really turned me off in the other thread was Andy himself. He made a lot of exaggerated claims and when confronted refused to admit it. When directly asked about issues with the trucks, he danced around the subject. He came across as a typical used car salesman. Any and all BS to get a sale and make you happy. Hopefully he is just the problem and not a representation of the way the company is operated.

I'm with Charles though. The proof is in the pudding. Let's see some happy owners. All I've seen are unhappy ones.
I have to agree with John, when confronted with actual shoddy workmanship of the trucks HE sold it was full on spamming used car salesman BS. A "pre-production, pre-promotional truck!?! WTF is that nonsense? I mean really, own your mistakes. I have to in my business and trust me I get a pissed off customer from time to time and I can't feed them a line of bullshit or I will lose a customer.

I know Lav and Jonsey personally and trust them with out question. But at the end of the day there is a serious disconnect between what you guys saw and Arkonik's shitty reputation over here with a good portion of their customers and the shops who are having to deal with these trucks. I just find it odd not one customer/shop has showed up to sing Arkonik's praises. Time will tell if the PR matches the product.
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  #62  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:48 AM
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I'm happy to go also when I get a chance, at my own expense. In fact, I'll visit any company over here who wants to show their operation "open kimono."
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  #63  
Old December 1st, 2015, 03:59 AM
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I'm sure all three of them had other things to do when they were in the UK. I know to how hard it is to create the time to do these kinds if visits. Years ago I stopped in on Ashtree to look at their operation before I bought. Traveling around the UK by road isn't quick and easy in the UK.
Betting that Jonesy enjoyed driving RHD vehicles again on his "native" side of the road!
Thank you for putting in the effort and taking the time.
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  #64  
Old December 1st, 2015, 07:53 AM
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I'm sure all three of them had other things to do when they were in the UK. I know to how hard it is to create the time to do these kinds if visits. Years ago I stopped in on Ashtree to look at their operation before I bought. Traveling around the UK by road isn't quick and easy in the UK.
Betting that Jonesy enjoyed driving RHD vehicles again on his "native" side of the road!
Thank you for putting in the effort and taking the time.
Thanks Chris - yeah, I did do the majority of driving on the road...it sure was nice to do it in a 2014 Puma 110...only buggered up once (but I blame Lav). One thing was absolutely certain, John was not getting behind the wheel on the road...I think he squeeled when we said dude your on a road!! after coming off the green lanes (to be fair though this was right after his flight)

Seriously, we did have a good time, when we weren't picking on the builds and Arkonik's operations. And yes we were pretty tough on Andy.
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  #65  
Old December 1st, 2015, 10:35 AM
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Pics always prove it happened.

Lets hope these guys stay around longer than British Bulldog. (See how many of you old farts get that reference).


Thread hijack, but was BB the shop in the old mill in Fall River MA?


Back in '90-92(?) when I was looking for my first Rover project I came across these guys when I was visiting family, drove a decent RHD 88, saw big stack of nice galvy chassis and the place looked almost legit, but my snake-alert started pinging and I never followed up. Maybe I was wrong but they completely vaporized at some point after that.
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  #66  
Old December 1st, 2015, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Jonesy View Post
Thanks Chris - yeah, I did do the majority of driving on the road...it sure was nice to do it in a 2014 Puma 110...only buggered up once (but I blame Lav). One thing was absolutely certain, John was not getting behind the wheel on the road...I think he squeeled when we said dude your on a road!! after coming off the green lanes (to be fair though this was right after his flight)

Seriously, we did have a good time, when we weren't picking on the builds and Arkonik's operations. And yes we were pretty tough on Andy.
I was very comfortable for my first time driving an RHD offroad...Its the 5 minutes on the road that got the police called...sorry my instincts tells me to go to the right when approaching an oncoming car, horse, sheep and whatever else they have in the friggin road over there...oops.
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  #67  
Old December 1st, 2015, 11:08 AM
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Any discussion during the visit with Andy re their financial score card? What form of financial backing (debt vs. equity) are they using to stay afloat and what percentage of business plan is geared towards North American sales? For me it is most telling that a strong well positioned organization like Foleys, in terms of reputation and knowhow, decided they have no interest going direct in the NA market.
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  #68  
Old December 1st, 2015, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by phoenix37 View Post
I was very comfortable for my first time driving an RHD offroad...Its the 5 minutes on the road that got the police called...sorry my instincts tells me to go to the right when approaching an oncoming car, horse, sheep and whatever else they have in the friggin road over there...oops.
Bloody yanks who only know how to drive on the right side, not the correct side..
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  #69  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by 1of40 View Post
Any discussion during the visit with Andy re their financial score card? What form of financial backing (debt vs. equity) are they using to stay afloat and what percentage of business plan is geared towards North American sales? For me it is most telling that a strong well positioned organization like Foleys, in terms of reputation and knowhow, decided they have no interest going direct in the NA market.
You obviously haven't looked at their website .... Land Rovers for Export to North America | UK Land Rover Experts

You don't need to ask Andy ... his is a public company, as is Foley and they publish their company accounts for all to see.
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  #70  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by leastonce View Post
You obviously haven't looked at their website .... Land Rovers for Export to North America | UK Land Rover Experts

You don't need to ask Andy ... his is a public company, as is Foley and they publish their company accounts for all to see.
No idea how Foley can import a 300tdi, a galvanized chassis, or a TD5 on a galvanized chassis!!!!

Bloody cool if they can, though I suspect they were all pre 2012
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  #71  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:32 PM
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No idea how Foley can import a 300tdi, a galvanized chassis, or a TD5 on a galvanized chassis!!!!

Bloody cool if they can, though I suspect they were all pre 2012
There is more than one country in North America......
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  #72  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:43 PM
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You don't need to ask Andy ... his is a public company, as is Foley and they publish their company accounts for all to see.
interesting

ticker symbols/exchange(s)?
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  #73  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:49 PM
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interesting

ticker symbols/exchange(s)?
Public != Listed

All limited companies in the UK are required to publish accounts to Companies House https://www.gov.uk/government/organi...ompanies-house
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  #74  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:51 PM
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There is more than one country in North America......
Them up north get teenage Land Rovers.
We have to wait until they are adults......
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  #75  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:55 PM
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Them up north get teenage Land Rovers.
We have to wait until they are adults......
Can bring in nice factory TD5s every day of the week.
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  #76  
Old December 1st, 2015, 12:56 PM
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You obviously haven't looked at their website .... Land Rovers for Export to North America | UK Land Rover Experts You don't need to ask Andy ... his is a public company, as is Foley and they publish their company accounts for all to see.
Sorry, what I mean by going direct is active marketing to the NA market. That I don't believe they (Foley's) do but I could be dead wrong. Listed company financials and SEC filings are manipulated reports through the use of lawyers and accounting firms in theory to make companies comparable. At the end of the day the reader is left with nothing valuable to make sound judgment on. I'd love to hear what the Owner says his plan is as opposed to what his lawyer and accountants tell him he can legally get away with. .
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  #77  
Old December 1st, 2015, 01:11 PM
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so here is a questions:

how does the actual quality compare?
paint
fit and finish
carpet / floor lining
soft-tops
squeaks / rattles
engine bays
underside

i am going to get in a big pile of crap saying this:
mike may be a pain in the ass to some people, but by far he is the gold standard here in the states. no one can knock the condition / quality of his work. he is at the top of the pyramid here in the states.

i am not throwing stones at anyone here but can you compare the finished products and say they are par? [despite the accessories that are personal flavor, despite the colors.... i am talking the actual product.]


edit #1:
i have seen lots of "restored" trucks along the years. from mike, from this place, from that place, from the UK and by FAR the uk trucks are thee worst! checking paint, shitty doors, soft-tops that flap more than barry and josh fighting with each other, engine bays / seat boxes that are the original color and the outside is a different color...... and so on.

edit #2:
and when the truck gets here and needs warranty work, who does that process work? you have to bring it to a selected set of shops? you pay and they reimburse you?
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  #78  
Old December 1st, 2015, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by d90boy View Post
so here is a questions:

how does the actual quality compare?
paint
fit and finish
carpet / floor lining
soft-tops
squeaks / rattles
engine bays
underside

i am going to get in a big pile of crap saying this:
mike may be a pain in the ass to some people, but by far he is the gold standard here in the states. no one can knock the condition / quality of his work. he is at the top of the pyramid here in the states.

i am not throwing stones at anyone here but can you compare the finished products and say they are par? [despite the accessories that are personal flavor, despite the colors.... i am talking the actual product.]


i have seen lots of "restored" trucks along the years. from mike, from this place, from that place, from the UK and by FAR the uk trucks are thee worst! checking paint, shitty doors, soft-tops that flap more than barry and josh fighting with each other, engine bays / seat boxes that are the original color and the outside is a different color...... and so on.
Quality is a value proposition.

You can only compare if you compare cost vs work product.
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  #79  
Old December 1st, 2015, 01:36 PM
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Again, I don't think it is a good, or fair, comparison (unless they get into the price ranges we do).
So if they are doing $150K and up trucks, then it should be perfect, not leak and should be fully galvanized (frame, bulkhead, doors, T supports, brackets, etc.).
But if they are doing trucks that run $60K then they can't get there (IMO). I'm sure there is a market for those kinds of trucks, but you can't get perfection at that price point unless you do all the work yourself and do not bill for your time.

I think they should be judged for what they are. Not against some standard.

It is like used Defenders.
I suck at selling them because I point out all the flaws to people and then they think it is a "bad" truck. That really isn't the case. It is just old and a Defender, that doesn't make it a bad truck, in fact it might have been a great truck, just not perfect.

I'm not defending this UK shop. I doubt I have ever seen any of their work, but just like with everything else some people don't want or can't afford something fully restored (restored to my standards). Some people just want something nice.
My personal Defender is a POS. I love it though.

Post pictures of their work. Let customers be the judge. It isn't fair to compare 2 things with different prices and different build philosophies side by side.



Quote:
Originally Posted by d90boy View Post
so here is a questions:

how does the actual quality compare?
paint
fit and finish
carpet / floor lining
soft-tops
squeaks / rattles
engine bays
underside

i am going to get in a big pile of crap saying this:
mike may be a pain in the ass to some people, but by far he is the gold standard here in the states. no one can knock the condition / quality of his work. he is at the top of the pyramid here in the states.

i am not throwing stones at anyone here but can you compare the finished products and say they are par? [despite the accessories that are personal flavor, despite the colors.... i am talking the actual product.]


i have seen lots of "restored" trucks along the years. from mike, from this place, from that place, from the UK and by FAR the uk trucks are thee worst! checking paint, shitty doors, soft-tops that flap more than barry and josh fighting with each other, engine bays / seat boxes that are the original color and the outside is a different color...... and so on.
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  #80  
Old December 1st, 2015, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by ECR View Post
Again, I don't think it is a good, or fair, comparison (unless they get into the price ranges we do).
So if they are doing $150K and up trucks, then it should be perfect, not leak and should be fully galvanized (frame, bulkhead, doors, T supports, brackets, etc.).
But if they are doing trucks that run $60K then they can't get there (IMO). I'm sure there is a market for those kinds of trucks, but you can't get perfection at that price point unless you do all the work yourself and do not bill for your time.

I think they should be judged for what they are. Not against some standard.

It is like used Defenders.
I suck at selling them because I point out all the flaws to people and then they think it is a "bad" truck. That really isn't the case. It is just old and a Defender, that doesn't make it a bad truck, in fact it might have been a great truck, just not perfect.

I'm not defending this UK shop. I doubt I have ever seen any of their work, but just like with everything else some people don't want or can't afford something fully restored (restored to my standards). Some people just want something nice.
My personal Defender is a POS. I love it though.
Thank you...very well put...
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