Anyone restore an old house here? - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Non-Technical Discussions > Misc. Chit-Chat


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old May 18th, 2012, 11:13 AM
evilfij's Avatar
evilfij
Status: Offline
evilfij
I have never seen a rover in person
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on the internet
Posts: 14,688
Anyone restore an old house here?

Thinking of making the worst decision of my life and need some advice.

How much to replace all the electric in a three story 150 year old 5k sq/ft stone house with original plaster?
Plumbing for 3.5 baths and a kitchen?

Rest I can live with, but I need to figure out the mechanicals to make it livable for me.
__________________
*not legal advice*
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old May 18th, 2012, 11:15 AM
tjfslaughter's Avatar
tjfslaughter
Status: Online
thomas
Burbon
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NorthEast
Posts: 4,563
Does it have insulation? Most dont. You can fish all the lines. I looked at a 120 Y/O house and made an offer 2 weeks ago and there was no insulation.

Running Pex is cheap. Also look to see if there is a "chase" for the drain pipe. If there is (and there should be) you can change that to PVC easily.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old May 18th, 2012, 11:18 AM
rijosho's Avatar
rijosho
Status: Offline
Joshua
1995 Black ST - Rhinolined edition
Research Assistant/Eagle Eyes
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 16,557
Registry
No idea on price, but are you replacing all of the "electric" because it's all knob and tube? One of my best friends used to be a partner in a company that did home entertainment, and he ALWAYS suggested putting in data wires for communication/entertainment/Internet, etc. while your walls are open and while you're doing the other work.
__________________
Quote:
I am talking purely from an aesthetics standpoint.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old May 18th, 2012, 11:44 AM
DMSLongLake's Avatar
DMSLongLake
Status: Offline
Dave Sherwood
1994 D90 ST
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Long Lake, MN USA
Posts: 685
Registry
If you are doing all the electrical and plumbing, wouldn't it be easier to just tear out all the plaster and drywall the whole thing?
__________________
DMSLongLake

Current Rovers:
1994 D-90 ST #734
2006 LR3
2016 RRS

Past Rovers:
1997 Disco I
1988 Range Rover 40th Anniversary
1999 Disco II
1995 D-90 ST #2731
1997 Range Rover 4.6 HSE Vitesse
2003 Range Rover HSE
2008 RRS
2013 RRS
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:03 PM
leastonce's Avatar
leastonce
Status: Offline
Jason England
D-90 White 95 SW #65
Site Team
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 6,078
Registry
preserve what you can ... this country has so little history that 150 year old features in a house are well worth preserving.
__________________
Quote:
Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
Car Camping Collective founding member and Chief Executive Officer
Cat Camping Collective founding member and Chief Executive Officer
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:10 PM
evilfij's Avatar
evilfij
Status: Offline
evilfij
I have never seen a rover in person
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on the internet
Posts: 14,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by DMSLongLake View Post
If you are doing all the electrical and plumbing, wouldn't it be easier to just tear out all the plaster and drywall the whole thing?
Easier, yes, but the plaster and trim is amazing and I would like to save it. Basically the house has not been touched (other than keeping a roof on it) for 100 years. We are talking original sinks, toilets, closets with hooks in them rather than rods, etc.
__________________
*not legal advice*
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:10 PM
tjfslaughter's Avatar
tjfslaughter
Status: Online
thomas
Burbon
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NorthEast
Posts: 4,563
Quote:
Originally Posted by DMSLongLake View Post
If you are doing all the electrical and plumbing, wouldn't it be easier to just tear out all the plaster and drywall the whole thing?
I would never tear it out. Most likely there is no insulation (unless PO added it) You can run the lines very easily. Also the outlets are probably in the base moulding and can be easily accessed. With flexible pex its easy to run lines. Also it may have went from Coal heat to Forced hot air so adding an AC unit would be easy.

Most older home had a Chase (maybe 18" by 18" to run pipes etc through). I would love to buy house like this. The last one we offered on it was very simlar to what this one sounds like...
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:11 PM
evilfij's Avatar
evilfij
Status: Offline
evilfij
I have never seen a rover in person
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on the internet
Posts: 14,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by rijosho View Post
No idea on price, but are you replacing all of the "electric" because it's all knob and tube? One of my best friends used to be a partner in a company that did home entertainment, and he ALWAYS suggested putting in data wires for communication/entertainment/Internet, etc. while your walls are open and while you're doing the other work.
I just use wifi and cells phones so I don't really care about that. Yes, all knob and tube and seriously sketchy (broken switches, exposed panels, but it does have 100 amp service at least).

No way it has insulation from what I can tell.

------ Follow up post added May 18th, 2012 12:13 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjfslaughter View Post
Does it have insulation? Most dont. You can fish all the lines. I looked at a 120 Y/O house and made an offer 2 weeks ago and there was no insulation.

Running Pex is cheap. Also look to see if there is a "chase" for the drain pipe. If there is (and there should be) you can change that to PVC easily.
What is Pex and how do I see if it has a "chase"?

------ Follow up post added May 18th, 2012 12:14 PM ------

Also, do people run outlets to current code on a project like this? IE one every 6ft or whatever? I am pretty sure most of the rooms have no outlets.
__________________
*not legal advice*
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:19 PM
rijosho's Avatar
rijosho
Status: Offline
Joshua
1995 Black ST - Rhinolined edition
Research Assistant/Eagle Eyes
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 16,557
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij View Post
I just use wifi and cells phones so I don't really care about that.
It may not be for you right now, but it's good to have speaker wiring and all that other stuff just plumbed while you're doing the rest. Just sayin'. Saw a ton of times he'd be called back to a house after the walls were closed back up during a project, or a few years later, and it's one of those while you're in there you might as well type of deals.
__________________
Quote:
I am talking purely from an aesthetics standpoint.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:29 PM
sonoronos's Avatar
sonoronos
Status: Offline
Ed
None
Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 5,531
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij View Post
What is Pex and how do I see if it has a "chase"?
Pex is a tradename for polyethylene pipe.

Kind of like how Romex is a tradename for sheathed multi-wire electrical cable.

I personally wouldn't use PEX. I'd go copper all the way. If you think the house will be around for another 150 years, then it's worth it.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:34 PM
cabell's Avatar
cabell
Status: Offline
Cabell Crowther
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lynchburg, Virginia
Posts: 476
Highly recommend geothermal heat pump if the property will accomodate (need to install well, pond or underground loop). From that point there are many options for delivering the air in ducts as small as 4" diameter.

For the electric, you will likely be cutting / grinding out plaster / stone to create runs for wiring which will have to meet current code (you will have more receptacles than you want or need). Install wires, boxes and patch plaster.
Not difficult, but a bit time consuming compared to frame construction.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:41 PM
tjfslaughter's Avatar
tjfslaughter
Status: Online
thomas
Burbon
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NorthEast
Posts: 4,563
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij View Post


What is Pex and how do I see if it has a "chase"?


Also, do people run outlets to current code on a project like this? IE one every 6ft or whatever? I am pretty sure most of the rooms have no outlets.

Go into the basement and look for the drain pipe for the sewer (most likely case iron or brass unless it has been changed). Take a flash light and look towards the celing and see if there is a "box" around the pipe. It could go up through the house all the way to the highest drain point (most likely the toilet in the highest floor). There could be a similar chase for the water supply lines.

Code is a relative term. Get friendly with the inspector and ask him what your options are.

Also find out if the drain pipe is lead (to city sewer if applicable). If it is buy the insurance available through the water company ($5 a month here).

You can have the house injected with foam insulation after all the plumbing and electrical for about 4-5k depending on size.

------ Follow up post added May 18th, 2012 12:41 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by cabell View Post
Highly recommend geothermal heat pump if the property will accomodate (need to install well, pond or underground loop). From that point there are many options for delivering the air in ducts as small as 4" diameter.

For the electric, you will likely be cutting / grinding out plaster / stone to create runs for wiring which will have to meet current code (you will have more receptacles than you want or need). Install wires, boxes and patch plaster.
Not difficult, but a bit time consuming compared to frame construction.
AFCI's in the bedrooms most likely which are a bitch.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:42 PM
evilfij's Avatar
evilfij
Status: Offline
evilfij
I have never seen a rover in person
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on the internet
Posts: 14,688
What is the D-90.com forum of old house restoration?
__________________
*not legal advice*
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:44 PM
leastonce's Avatar
leastonce
Status: Offline
Jason England
D-90 White 95 SW #65
Site Team
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 6,078
Registry
Not as old as your place but Tom has done a beautiful job on his place!
__________________
Quote:
Soapy water / KY jelly, etc. is is basically a must. Yes, good idea to remove trim panels - only takes 5 more minutes to do so.
Car Camping Collective founding member and Chief Executive Officer
Cat Camping Collective founding member and Chief Executive Officer
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old May 18th, 2012, 12:50 PM
cabell's Avatar
cabell
Status: Offline
Cabell Crowther
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lynchburg, Virginia
Posts: 476
150 year old PA stone houses are usually plaster on stone, i.e. no wood framing. The only opportunity to insulate is the ceiling.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old May 18th, 2012, 01:02 PM
rover4x4's Avatar
rover4x4
Status: Offline
Phillip
1995 SW #487/500
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: The Old North State
Posts: 7,525
Registry
geothermal would be a really good way to heat, or a Jotel stove. Go for it, if the house is stone and its had a good roof the rest shouldnt be so bad. I found a "modernist" house here in Raleigh that needed work but sadly it is more of a teardown that a refurb

------ Follow up post added May 18th, 2012 01:02 PM ------

this thread is useless without pictures
__________________
Poor gas mileage gets you to the best places on earth
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old May 18th, 2012, 01:06 PM
evilfij's Avatar
evilfij
Status: Offline
evilfij
I have never seen a rover in person
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: on the internet
Posts: 14,688
Quote:
Originally Posted by cabell View Post
150 year old PA stone houses are usually plaster on stone, i.e. no wood framing. The only opportunity to insulate is the ceiling.
Really? That would suck to get wires in.

I don't have pics, but I will take a few from the street when I get home. It is all stone, huge and ancient. It also has trees too close to the house and has been neglected.

Ironically, the only new thing in the house is a brand new oil burner (who does that when it has gas lines!). I don't think geothermal is an option.
__________________
*not legal advice*
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old May 18th, 2012, 01:18 PM
Ren Ching's Avatar
Ren Ching
Status: Offline
Skinny Pete
'84 90 "Yamelo"/'88 RRC "Chewbacca"
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Downtown
Posts: 4,696
Registry
Router with a 3/4" plunge bit (or a handful of em) to cut chases in the plaster for the wiring. You can use wiremold or M/C cable so as to protect the wiring. Not that big of a deal. No point in doing it really if you aren't going to do it up to current code. Just finishing up some work on a friends $400k plus renovation of a million+ dollar home in upper NW DC where the builder walked off the job. Electrical is so-so at best, my guess is there was no final inspection as all three bathrooms' receptacles are wired together with GFI's feeding each other on the load side and the smoke alarms were tied in with a lighting circuit. Among other questionable practices. No AFCI's anywhere and as I understand it almost everything has to be on one of those of late. OTOH, if it is knob and tube and the wiring is sound, just replace the outlets and switches and live with it. You may be able to add a few things here and there. I have run wiring behind baseboard with nail plates to protect the wiring or using MC cable etc. I do small electrical jobs for hire in DC but I don't have much of a sense of what a job that size would cost. Depending on how extensive it gets I'd venture 40-50k MAX for the demo, plumbing, electrical, and closing up the walls etc. I can send a team of highly skilled Salvadorans up your way if you want it cheaper. Add $$$ if you are replacing bathroom and kitchen fixtures and finishes and not just redoing the plumbing. I know there are some homebuilders on here that will correct all of my BS above...

Also, Doug and I stayed in a stone house in the UK that has had updated everything. Including radiant heated flooring. It was quite lovely. If you can't to go that route then you are into the $100K and up range.

Go for it!

(Says the guy who is still renovating my now 98-year-old house that was only 88 years old when I bought it)


Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij View Post
Thinking of making the worst decision of my life and need some advice.

How much to replace all the electric in a three story 150 year old 5k sq/ft stone house with original plaster?
Plumbing for 3.5 baths and a kitchen?

Rest I can live with, but I need to figure out the mechanicals to make it livable for me.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old May 18th, 2012, 01:24 PM
cabell's Avatar
cabell
Status: Offline
Cabell Crowther
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lynchburg, Virginia
Posts: 476
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilfij View Post
Really? That would suck to get wires in.

I don't have pics, but I will take a few from the street when I get home. It is all stone, huge and ancient. It also has trees too close to the house and has been neglected.

Ironically, the only new thing in the house is a brand new oil burner (who does that when it has gas lines!). I don't think geothermal is an option.
That oil burner will eat a huge hole in your pocketbook! In addition to heat, geothermal provides A/C (at almost no cost).
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old May 18th, 2012, 01:35 PM
brn24whl's Avatar
brn24whl
Status: Offline
Eric
1994 RRC SWB
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Capital District NYS
Posts: 1,214
Registry
Just be careful an old house can or will drive you insane.... Kinda like old Rovers ;-)
__________________
Eric Riston
Commission-Based Retail Sales Representative
1-800-533-2210 ext 231
Direct Line 518-539-2231

If ordering on our online site please choose me as the sales rep. If placing a phone order please call me directly at the numbers above.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Non-Technical Discussions > Misc. Chit-Chat

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My house is getting foreclosed! Departing90 Misc. Chit-Chat 6 March 29th, 2009 03:13 PM
Restore or Not to Restore Heathbarcrunch Defender Technical Discussions 6 November 12th, 2007 03:05 AM
Architects, a rant... Emerson00 Misc. Chit-Chat 26 November 4th, 2007 07:59 PM
OT: NASA's JPL Open House - This weekend, May 14-15, 2005 arbik Misc. Chit-Chat 0 May 13th, 2005 06:47 PM
Restore of the forum Pt.2 chrisvonc Community News & Announcements 2 July 18th, 2004 10:03 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:28 PM.


Copyright