Alternative power train from South Africa - Defender Source
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  #1  
Old November 19th, 2013, 04:51 PM
MonLand
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Alternative power train from South Africa

Interested if anyone here knows anything about what this took to implement?

"Land Rover South Africa offered a unique Defender during the period the group was owned by BMW. Between 1997 and 2000, the Defender 90 and 110 were offered with a BMW petrol engine alongside the normal Tdi engine. The engine was the BMW M52 2800 cc, straight-six, 24-valve engine as found in the BMW 328i, 528i, 728i and the Z3. Power and torque output for this engine was 142 kW (190 hp) @ 5500 rpm and 280 Nm (207 lbft) @ 3500 rpm. This option was offered due to a demand for a petrol-driven alternative to the diesel engine after production of the V8 Defender had ended. The vehicles were built at Rosslyn outside Pretoria. Total production for the 2.8i was 632 Defender 90s and 410 Defender 110s. Early models were not speed-restricted, but later models were limited to 160 km/h." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Land_Rover_Defender)
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  #2  
Old November 19th, 2013, 04:57 PM
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Shouldn't take much, BMWs used the same ZF4HP22 autobox that Rover used for a long time so the bell housing shouldn't be too hard to sort. Other than adjusting the motor mounts to suit and wiring up the engine shouldn't be too terribly hard to get up and running if you had a M52 just sitting around collecting dust.
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Old November 19th, 2013, 04:59 PM
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Yeah we've discussed it a few times. Pretty cool.

http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...1&postcount=11
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Old November 19th, 2013, 04:59 PM
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Pretty sweet ride I would say.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi....8i_engine.jpg
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  #5  
Old November 19th, 2013, 05:17 PM
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I assume this gives access to all ancillaries from the BMW world (AC compressor, high output alternators, power steering, etc)?
What are the drawbacks? Any BMW computer involved in there?
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  #6  
Old November 19th, 2013, 05:22 PM
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Never built as a LHD model- may or may not be issues there.
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  #7  
Old November 19th, 2013, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MonLand View Post
I assume this gives access to all ancillaries from the BMW world (AC compressor, high output alternators, power steering, etc)? What are the drawbacks? Any BMW computer involved in there?
I assume they are Bosch computers like bmw and d2.
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Old November 19th, 2013, 05:52 PM
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A member had a manual belhousing that bolted to an R380 to take a BMW engine.
I think the belhousing came from a manual P38, but could be wrong as don't remember exactly.
Nice guy who did a little guess what this belhousing is for thread.
It went a few pages before someone identified the belhousing correctly.
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  #9  
Old November 19th, 2013, 06:31 PM
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Hum... That's right, there were BMW-powered P38, right? Maybe even the D2 got that option?
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  #10  
Old November 19th, 2013, 06:45 PM
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Never in D2

P38 got 2.4 diesel
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #11  
Old November 19th, 2013, 08:24 PM
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I think the BMW motor in the P38's was the diesel.

All of the parts for the BMW motor in the Defender are in Microcat.
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  #12  
Old June 12th, 2014, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdavisinva View Post
A member had a manual belhousing that bolted to an R380 to take a BMW engine.
I think the belhousing came from a manual P38, but could be wrong as don't remember exactly.
Nice guy who did a little guess what this belhousing is for thread.
It went a few pages before someone identified the belhousing correctly.
That would be me.
Here's a link to my build thread: http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=313586. I put it on a BMW forum because I've been quite involved there and I also like how you can insert photos directly into posts. Here's a link to my other build thread there where I put an E46 M3 engine in my E30 (at the time only a handful of people had done it): http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=237727.
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  #13  
Old June 12th, 2014, 09:59 PM
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Only issues I can see on LHD are the intake on the m52 is wide and may interfere withthe brake booster. My guess is it certainly will.

Otherwise you'd need the harness from the bmw with the computer. Not a terribly hard swap..... Though a Chevy v8 is a lot easier.

Now an S52 motor would be a lot more worth it....
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  #14  
Old June 12th, 2014, 10:11 PM
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Andrew, you can insert pictures directly into posts here too, so don't be shy to put your build here too

I'd like to see how the electric power steering pump works.
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  #15  
Old June 12th, 2014, 10:30 PM
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I like the BMW idea but being in the US think the prospect of the Mustang engine paired with the six speed box used in the Pumas might be better.,
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #16  
Old June 12th, 2014, 11:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roving Beetle View Post
Only issues I can see on LHD are the intake on the m52 is wide and may interfere withthe brake booster. My guess is it certainly will. Otherwise you'd need the harness from the bmw with the computer. Not a terribly hard swap..... Though a Chevy v8 is a lot easier. Now an S52 motor would be a lot more worth it....
The intake on the M54 isn't as wide as the M52's. Hopefully there won't be a clearance issue there. I have the harness and the computer. It's $600 to have the computer flashed standalone. If I wanted a V8 I'd keep what's in there. The M54 has better power in lower RPM's due to the double VANOS, gets better MPG, and is smoother than the S52. ------ Follow up post added June 12th, 2014 08:39 PM ------
Quote:
Originally Posted by cgalpin View Post
Andrew, you can insert pictures directly into posts here too, so don't be shy to put your build here too I'd like to see how the electric power steering pump works.
Good to know! Thanks! I'll make a thread here too. ------ Follow up post added June 12th, 2014 08:40 PM ------
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
I like the BMW idea but being in the US think the prospect of the Mustang engine paired with the six speed box used in the Pumas might be better.,
Which Mustang engine would that be? That sounds interesting.
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  #17  
Old June 13th, 2014, 01:09 AM
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For what it's worth, I read somewhere that the engine sucks in a defender which is why they never brought it into full production... All the power is in the high end ... Not a truck engine but a racing car engine...
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Old June 13th, 2014, 06:10 AM
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Andrew: discussed already in a few threads: http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...ad.php?t=28157 The Mustang uses it on the 3.7 and 5liter. Honestly the 3.7 is plenty powerful for the Defender. Ford Australia puts the box behind The i5 3.2 Ford diesel in the Ranger. Same engine is that's in the new Transit.
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A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
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  #19  
Old June 13th, 2014, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Arcadeus View Post
For what it's worth, I read somewhere that the engine sucks in a defender which is why they never brought it into full production... All the power is in the high end ... Not a truck engine but a racing car engine...
I've read very good things about the Defender 2.8i. Someone who owns one on the LandyOnline forum says it has good power and claims it "was the best Defender ever built!" -> http://www.landyonline.co.za/landyfo...php?f=5&t=1844. The 3.0L M54 I'm putting in mine is more powerful than the 2.8L M52 (225 hp @ 5900 rpm & 221 lbft of torque @ 3500 rpm vs. 190 hp @ 5500 rpm & 210 lbft of torque @ 3500 rpm.) The Rover 3.9L V8 is rated at 182 hp @ 4750 rpm & 232 lbft of torque @ 3100 rpm. If we look at this graph from BMW that compares the power of the M54 to the M52, we can see that the M54 acheives about 195-200 hp at the V8's peak at 4750 rpms. So discounting the V8's slight torque advantage, it's a more powerful engine. Plus it's much more efficient, very smooth, and probably weighs less (375 lbs vs ~440lbs?). Better all around IMO.



Here's a Land Rover 3.9L V8 power graph:



Engine weight data:
BMW M54: http://www.usautoparts.net/bmw/engines/m54.htm
Rover V8: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/t...Marquis+%2BRex
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  #20  
Old June 13th, 2014, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
Andrew: discussed already in a few threads: http://www.defendersource.com/forum/...ad.php?t=28157 The Mustang uses it on the 3.7 and 5liter. Honestly the 3.7 is plenty powerful for the Defender. Ford Australia puts the box behind The i5 3.2 Ford diesel in the Ranger. Same engine is that's in the new Transit.
Hmm, that's interesting. As far as bolting it to the transfer case would I just need to replace the rear casing and shaft? The 3.7 looks like it's kind of a wide engine though. If I was going the Ford route I think I'd get the small lightweight 2.0 I4 EcoBoost. According to Ford it produces 252 Horsepower @ 5,500 RPM & 270 lb. ft. of torque @ 3,000 RPM. And, "When used with Engine Control Pack M-6017-20T and 93 octane unleaded fuel, torque is increased 90 lb. ft at 2800 RPM - with a significant increase up to 4200 RPM." That's pretty cool they offer a crate engine and an ECU and wiring kit.
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