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  #21  
Old February 19th, 2012, 05:39 PM
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These black market trucks are just the cheapfuck's way of driving a new Defender. The right way to do it is to buy a NAS or a 25 year-old truck and bring it up to current year standards. That costs a lot more and these guys don't want to pay for it.

I have no problem with them importing and driving one, that's their moral compass, not mine. My issue is when one of these guys tries to sell it to the unsuspecting buyer. We've all seen this happen here from time to time. These people need to be called out in their for sale thread. It's a disservice to future owners not to call them out.
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  #22  
Old February 19th, 2012, 05:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris snell View Post
These black market trucks are just the cheapfuck's way of driving a new Defender. The right way to do it is to buy a NAS or a 25 year-old truck and bring it up to current year standards. That costs a lot more and these guys don't want to pay for it.

I have no problem with them importing and driving one, that's their moral compass, not mine. My issue is when one of these guys tries to sell it to the unsuspecting buyer. We've all seen this happen here from time to time. These people need to be called out in their for sale thread. It's a disservice to future owners not to call them out.
Snell is right, breaking the "never flame a for sale thread code" for a clear 2011 defender being marketed as a 1985 not only is forum duty but could actually save someone's life. If the feds say that my DOT approved 1993 110 is safer then a 2011 Puma we shouldn't question that.

NAS Defenders save lives...
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  #23  
Old February 19th, 2012, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris snell View Post
These black market trucks are just the cheapfuck's way of driving a new Defender.
I don't think $75K is "cheapfuck" money. And people who have $75K in cash don't usually blink much at another $25-50K............especially for a "toy" like this.

I would guess a NAS 110 to 2011 Puma restoration would likely be north of $125K............and even worse would take 1-2 years. I don't see them come to market much at any price. So it's not just a money thing. And restoring an 1985 110 "legally" with a pathetic engine wouldn't appeal to many.

I also don't think it's a moral decision made with a "moral compass". We are talking about trucks here and the regulations that I think you yourself would agree are arcane and somewhat arbitrary.

I completely agree and support strongly your suggestions about "reselling" to unsuspecting people.


So is your argument that we shouldn't buy a Puma because it's illegal?


Otherwise it's just as safe as an NAS 110 and has a cleaner burning engine than MOST cars and trucks on the road!! You might be drinking too much of the government subsidized kool-aid.

These trucks should have never been regulated out of the country to begin with..............THAT is the real problem and moral problem.

What's next, regulating firearms?? HA!

------ Follow up post added February 19th, 2012 07:13 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by NomaD110 View Post
NAS Defenders save lives...
I love it. I could see that on a billboard.
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  #24  
Old February 19th, 2012, 06:39 PM
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Ken Jagolta
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odd

Anyone else notice that the guy's name on the LRX Ad is Triston Caldwell and his name is Ian on this site. Maybe Triston is his lawyer? If so his name is probably Tristan. Maybe intentional typo?
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  #25  
Old February 19th, 2012, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by NomaD110 View Post
You are right about your insurance. But I think what you would need to worry about would be the other guys insurance. If you kill someone in your 1985 Puma Defender you can rest assure that their lawyer is going to do his best to prove that you are liable because your truck isn't DOT to the letter of the law regardless of what it says on the title.
And what would you think it would happen in the same scenario with a NAS truck lifted, no sway bars, cow killer bumper ( that happened to hit the side where the person died ) , etc.?

Arguments will take place by the barracudas no matter what , you could be in an Amish Sulky and still be sued

------ Follow up post added February 19th, 2012 06:51 PM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by nikojo View Post
I don't think $75K is "cheapfuck" money. And people who have $75K in cash don't usually blink much at another $25-50K............especially for a "toy" like this.

I would guess a NAS 110 to 2011 Puma restoration would likely be north of $125K............and even worse would take 1-2 years. I don't see them come to market much at any price. So it's not just a money thing. And restoring an 1985 110 "legally" with a pathetic engine wouldn't appeal to many.

I also don't think it's a moral decision made with a "moral compass". We are talking about trucks here and the regulations that I think you yourself would agree are arcane and somewhat arbitrary.

I completely agree and support strongly your suggestions about "reselling" to unsuspecting people.


So is your argument that we shouldn't buy a Puma because it's illegal?


Otherwise it's just as safe as an NAS 110 and has a cleaner burning engine than MOST cars and trucks on the road!! You might be drinking too much of the government subsidized kool-aid.

These trucks should have never been regulated out of the country to begin with..............THAT is the real problem and moral problem.

What's next, regulating firearms?? HA!

------ Follow up post added February 19th, 2012 07:13 PM ------



I love it. I could see that on a billboard.
A NAS 110 converted to PUMA specs ( totally including the engine ) will not be much different in an argument in front of a judge..
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  #26  
Old February 19th, 2012, 07:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rugbier View Post
And what would you think it would happen in the same scenario with a NAS truck lifted, no sway bars, cow killer bumper ( that happened to hit the side where the person died ) , etc.?

Arguments will take place by the barracudas no matter what , you could be in an Amish Sulky and still be sued

------ Follow up post added February 19th, 2012 06:51 PM ------



A NAS 110 converted to PUMA specs ( totally including the engine ) will not be much different in an argument in front of a judge..
Oh no I'm sorry if I made it sound like a NAS truck is immune from liability...no one is safe. The sue first ask questions later society we live in would nail anyone regardless of what you drive.

As for an original NAS 110 converted to whatever you are right in front of a judge would not make a difference.

I am talking about a NAS truck compared to an illegally imported one. It would just be another thing to be liable for.
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  #27  
Old February 19th, 2012, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
What about those who sleep on mattresses with the tag removed?

-Jeff
Jeff we are talking about reasonable situations here...don't be ridiculous. Might as well go skydiving without a parachute.
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  #28  
Old February 19th, 2012, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by JSBriggs View Post
What about those who sleep on mattresses with the tag removed?

-Jeff
I know a guy who knows a guy whose mattress was seized by the feds because he tore the tag off. Actually, he swapped the tag from an older mattress onto a newer, illegal mattress because he was such a cheapfuck.
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  #29  
Old February 19th, 2012, 09:05 PM
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I heard there's a guy that lurks on mattress boards and reports people who pull their mattress tags off to the Feds. Must be an urban legend.
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  #30  
Old February 19th, 2012, 11:22 PM
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Show me the law that says you can't do a motor swap on an 8X legally imported defender once it is in the US (this is in response to the SBC swap point). You can't import a motor unless it falls under an exemption. 21 years for EPA for trucks, I have not looked into motors. 200 tdi some are over 21 years now.

As far as "bringing one up to current spec" you are actually better with an EPA exempt import than a NAS truck as taking emissions shit off a NAS truck is illegal. 80s imports are exempt. Import it with the original engine (completely legal), import your parts (no drivetrain truck is parts) and restore it. Very low risk. The only catch is the rebuild catch that you might be consider to have manufactured the car. I would go to the mat on that. The real catch is putting in an engine that is EPA ok.
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  #31  
Old February 20th, 2012, 04:42 AM
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Moving away from mattresses' (??) and back on topic for a moment.

This guy isn't doing himself any favors. His listed name on this site at least as of yesterday was Ian (no relation, honest) as was mentioned above. Now he's listed as 'NONAME'.

He's added some more info to the for sale thread, although still no official price. Supposedly this truck was purchased new by a Mr. German guy, who shipped it to S. America somewhere for his daughter to use for a vacation. It was driven up and made it to the US. At which point Mr. NONAME purchased the truck from Mr. German dude.

Question, don't you have to register a bond or security or something if you bring a non-importable vehicle into the country that you get back when you take it out again? Might be wrong there. But if i'm not then Mr. G is pretty stupid in this story.

Anyway, Mr. NONAME has dug himself a deeper hole in my opinion. Besides playing shifty with his name, he's also virtually admitted that he is the importer and also the one who put the wrong identity onto the truck to title it. It could I suppose have been Mr. German guy but I don't believe so. He wouldn't have a US truck ID to title it with or any way to title it here in the US as a non-citizen/resident would he? Anything is possible I suppose but I highly doubt it.

I was prepared to give this guy a bit of slack on the off chance that he was a victim of some other shady character and was left holding the stick/truck. Now I think its way more likely that he IS the shady character and is just trying to pass his failed mess off onto some other unsuspecting victim. BUYER BEWARE.

I go back to what I said before. If this guy really wants out from under this mess he should part out the truck minus the engine. Make what he can from the parts and then scrap the engine and false ID and be done with it. If he sells the truck whole with the engine and dodgy ID and he is the importer of record then he's just building a noose that may hang him and somebody else sometime down the line (again).
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  #32  
Old February 20th, 2012, 11:52 AM
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Soooo, if it is titled as an earlier year, how is it illegal to drive? Is the title just bogus... I am unclear on what is being said here. I am interested in the car, but the legalities are unclear to me. I license in a no inspection state of FLorida or Montana - so I am not concerned about the draconian CA laws.
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  #33  
Old February 20th, 2012, 11:53 AM
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titled as a series truck in CA.
imported through mexico.
no galvi chassis - still on the original 2010 chassis with the "real" vin number stamped on it.
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  #34  
Old February 20th, 2012, 12:07 PM
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So in english - The title is from and old series and the dash has a vin tag "replaced" with an old one. If a government official were to look very hard, one would be convicted of a felony - am I right?
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  #35  
Old February 20th, 2012, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by pipermalibu View Post
So in english - The title is from and old series and the dash has a vin tag "replaced" with an old one. If a government official were to look very hard, one would be convicted of a felony - am I right?
you wouldn't necessarily get convicted, but you'd definatly loose the truck
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  #36  
Old February 20th, 2012, 12:23 PM
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not sure.
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  #37  
Old February 20th, 2012, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf Fabrication
You are probably safe driving it until you get in an accident or get pulled over by a smart cop.
Get pulled over by a smart cop? What is a cop going to do? If the owner of this truck gets pulled over for a moving violation why would a cop care of this truck was restored, rebuilt, or titled as a pinto? I don't give a shit about this truck but those types of statements just add to the hysteria with no proof behind them.
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  #38  
Old February 20th, 2012, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by bjf

Get pulled over by a smart cop? What is a cop going to do? If the owner of this truck gets pulled over for a moving violation why would a cop care of this truck was restored, rebuilt, or titled as a pinto? I don't give a shit about this truck but those types of statements just add to the hysteria with no proof behind them.
You certainly are entitled to your opinion. These comments are best reserved for the other thread. Cheers.
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  #39  
Old February 20th, 2012, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Wolf Fabrication

You certainly are entitled to your opinion. These comments are best reserved for the other thread. Cheers.
Well technically both are opinions.
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  #40  
Old February 20th, 2012, 01:19 PM
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Well technically both are opinions.
Absolutely!
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