NAS D90 rear cross memeber - Defender Source
Defender Source  

Go Back   Defender Source > Classifieds > Wanted


Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old July 30th, 2014, 08:38 PM
ADK46er's Avatar
ADK46er
Status: Offline
Craig Longenecker
97 D90 SW
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 284
NAS D90 rear cross memeber

Looks like I need to replace my rear cross member. Galvanized or not let me know if anyone has one.
Thanks!
Craig
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old July 30th, 2014, 09:35 PM
Uncle Douglas's Avatar
Uncle Douglas
Status: Online
Doug Crowther
A defender in every driveway-motto
D-90 Source Vendor
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Gods Country- Central Virginia
Posts: 11,841
Registry
Welding a galvanized one on is a pita and difficult to do well.
__________________
Good judgement comes from experience,experience comes from bad judgement.

Dividing Creek Imports
Worldwide Vehicle Shipment and Importation Service
Restoration & Modification work


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

410.693.1391


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old July 30th, 2014, 09:37 PM
rd10014's Avatar
rd10014
Status: Offline
Ronnie
1993 NAS D110
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: NYC
Posts: 923
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by ADK46er View Post
Looks like I need to replace my rear cross member. Galvanized or not let me know if anyone has one. Thanks! Craig
Go with the galv!
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #4  
Old July 30th, 2014, 09:41 PM
Rocky's Avatar
Rocky
Status: Offline
Chris
72 + D1 drivetrain
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Colonies Aka Boston
Posts: 8,791
I've seen people weld a plate over the crossmember only to replace the entire chassis two or three years later.
How's your bulkhead?
__________________
A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old July 31st, 2014, 07:33 AM
ADK46er's Avatar
ADK46er
Status: Offline
Craig Longenecker
97 D90 SW
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle Douglas View Post
Welding a galvanized one on is a pita and difficult to do well.
That's why I have a pro doing the work for me.

------ Follow up post added July 31st, 2014 07:38 AM ------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
I've seen people weld a plate over the crossmember only to replace the entire chassis two or three years later.
How's your bulkhead?
Everything else is in great shape. This started out as a "hey, lets replace the gas tank skid plate". You couldn't tell the cross member was bad until the gas tank was out, it looked great from everywhere else.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old July 31st, 2014, 07:43 AM
1of40's Avatar
1of40
Status: Offline
1of40
NAS 97SW & 83 One Ten Tdi
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Potomac Falls & Wintergreen, Virginia
Posts: 6,085
Registry
Makes sense on a full galvy chassis but putting a galvy piece on a 20 year old chassis makes a little less sense to me, especially if there is a heavy premium on purchase price and installation.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old July 31st, 2014, 08:15 AM
Rocky's Avatar
Rocky
Status: Offline
Chris
72 + D1 drivetrain
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Colonies Aka Boston
Posts: 8,791
It's also difficult and unhealthy to weld Galvanized metal due to the fumes given off.
You have to grind off all the galvy before welding.
If you want to do just the rear crossmember go for regular steel.
__________________
A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old July 31st, 2014, 08:48 AM
the rover shop
Status: Offline
shayne young
89,93 & 95 camel trophy 110s 06 130
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ft lauderdale florida
Posts: 5,225
I was really sick for a couple of weeks after doing a lot of light welding on some galv stuff indoors when I was younger... I'll probably end up dying from that shit.. Weld in well ventilated area with a respirator mask on.. Your children will thank you for it....
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old July 31st, 2014, 09:13 AM
Holiday's Avatar
Holiday
Status: Offline
Ross Simpson
1995 D90 ST/2006 D3 HSE7
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hamilton, VA
Posts: 456
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
It's also difficult and unhealthy to weld Galvanized metal due to the fumes given off.
You have to grind off all the galvy before welding.
If you want to do just the rear crossmember go for regular steel.


Respectfully of course, I disagree. The crossmember area is the most rust prone section of the chassis. If it's bad enough to cut off and replace, why replace it with the same uncoated steel that allowed the corrosion in the first place? The labor is the same whether it's galvy or steel that you're installing, so the only price difference comes down to the $100-$200 for the galvy. A small price to pay to avoid re-doing the job 10-15 years later.
If the rest of the chassis is corroded, then replacing it with a galvy version is the prudent way to go, but at ~$1900-2100 for galvy crossmember replacement vs. ~$7,000-10,000 for a full galvy-chassis swap (parts included for both); if you don't need it- save yourself the $6k-8k...


Let's make sure we're giving these guys solid info!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old July 31st, 2014, 09:36 AM
Rocky's Avatar
Rocky
Status: Offline
Chris
72 + D1 drivetrain
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Colonies Aka Boston
Posts: 8,791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday View Post
Respectfully of course, I disagree. The crossmember area is the most rust prone section of the chassis. If it's bad enough to cut off and replace, why replace it with the same uncoated steel that allowed the corrosion in the first place? The labor is the same whether it's galvy or steel that you're installing, so the only price difference comes down to the $100-$200 for the galvy. A small price to pay to avoid re-doing the job 10-15 years later.
If the rest of the chassis is corroded, then replacing it with a galvy version is the prudent way to go, but at ~$1900-2100 for galvy crossmember replacement vs. ~$7,000-10,000 for a full galvy-chassis swap (parts included for both); if you don't need it- save yourself the $6k-8k...


Let's make sure we're giving these guys solid info!
Why regular steel?

By the time that regular steel replacement crossmember rots out, the rest of the regular steel chassis will be swiss cheese and a galvy replacement for the entire chassis will be the only option.

I'm firmly in the camp of full galvy replacement chassis, no half measures. But the OP prefers a more economical route at this time.

If you look at the economics, using your numbers, he will spend between $8,900 and 12,100 repairing then replacing the chassis.

Its his vehicle his choice.

Here is something to read if considering welding galvanized metal: http://www.aws.org/technical/facts/FACT-25.pdf
__________________
A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old July 31st, 2014, 09:50 AM
don's Avatar
don
Status: Offline
Don Bunnell
'86 110 3dr ST
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Rumson, NJ
Posts: 4,272
Registry
I vote regular metal replacement then POR-15, topcoat and Waxoyl the hell out of the inside cavities. With the tank out it's pretty easy to access and paint.

And slather cooper or grey anti-seize on all bolts. That back end is a tarp for dirt and mud but keeping an eye on it goes a long way.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old July 31st, 2014, 09:50 AM
ADK46er's Avatar
ADK46er
Status: Offline
Craig Longenecker
97 D90 SW
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
Why regular steel?

By the time that regular steel replacement crossmember rots out, the rest of the regular steel chassis will be swiss cheese and a galvy replacement for the entire chassis will be the only option.

I'm firmly in the camp of full galvy replacement chassis, no half measures. But the OP prefers a more economical route at this time.

If you look at the economics, using your numbers, he will spend between $8,900 and 12,100 repairing then replacing the chassis.

Its his vehicle his choice.

Here is something to read if considering welding galvanized metal: http://www.aws.org/technical/facts/FACT-25.pdf
Thanks for the input. I will talk to my guy, he is a vender here with a great reputation.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old July 31st, 2014, 10:01 AM
ADK46er's Avatar
ADK46er
Status: Offline
Craig Longenecker
97 D90 SW
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Maryland
Posts: 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by don View Post
I vote regular metal replacement then POR-15, topcoat and Waxoyl the hell out of the inside cavities. With the tank out it's pretty easy to access and paint.

And slather cooper or grey anti-seize on all bolts. That back end is a tarp for dirt and mud but keeping an eye on it goes a long way.
This is what we will do.
Thanks guys for the input.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old July 31st, 2014, 04:57 PM
Holiday's Avatar
Holiday
Status: Offline
Ross Simpson
1995 D90 ST/2006 D3 HSE7
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hamilton, VA
Posts: 456
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
Why regular steel?

By the time that regular steel replacement crossmember rots out, the rest of the regular steel chassis will be swiss cheese and a galvy replacement for the entire chassis will be the only option.

I'm firmly in the camp of full galvy replacement chassis, no half measures. But the OP prefers a more economical route at this time.

If you look at the economics, using your numbers, he will spend between $8,900 and 12,100 repairing then replacing the chassis.

Its his vehicle his choice.

Here is something to read if considering welding galvanized metal: http://www.aws.org/technical/facts/FACT-25.pdf



For the sake of anyone else reading this thread in the future- the error in your argument is your belief that a chassis, forward of the crossmember, will not survive for 10-15 years without galvanizing.


My 95' is about 19.5 years old and is rust free forward of the CM- how old is yours? Anyone that has dabbled in antique cars knows that frames that are well cared for- last for decades. It's the "scoop" design of the Defender CM and typical offroad/mud-catching use of these trucks that makes the CM prone to corrosion- not age itself.


Properly cared for (thorough cleaning, waxoyl, and/or an occasional coat of POR-15), and you simply don't need to replace the original chassis.


Again- with regard to the CM itself- it's only $100-200 difference in price between galvanized and steel. Since a galvanized CM prevents corrosion in one of the more highly susceptible areas of the chassis for $100-200 extra, why would anyone install a steel replacement?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old July 31st, 2014, 05:14 PM
Rocky's Avatar
Rocky
Status: Offline
Chris
72 + D1 drivetrain
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Colonies Aka Boston
Posts: 8,791
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holiday View Post
For the sake of anyone else reading this thread in the future- the error in your argument is your belief that a chassis, forward of the crossmember, will not survive for 10-15 years without galvanizing.


My 95' is about 19.5 years old and is rust free forward of the CM- how old is yours? Anyone that has dabbled in antique cars knows that frames that are well cared for- last for decades. It's the "scoop" design of the Defender CM and typical offroad/mud-catching use of these trucks that makes the CM prone to corrosion- not age itself.


Properly cared for (thorough cleaning, waxoyl, and/or an occasional coat of POR-15), and you simply don't need to replace the original chassis.


Again- with regard to the CM itself- it's only $100-200 difference in price between galvanized and steel. Since a galvanized CM prevents corrosion in one of the more highly susceptible areas of the chassis for $100-200 extra, why would anyone install a steel replacement?
For the sake of anyone reading this in the future, the error in your argument is assuming that a 19 year old chassis is still safe. I've seen 2004 Discovery chassis with holes big enough to put a fist threw. Take that chassis and add another 19 to it...well even you should understand the consequences of that.

The important thing here is that the OP, as I said before can make his own decisions, which will fit in with his needs. That's not for you to dictate.
__________________
A friend of mine runs a land rover / range rover specialty repair shop. Based on his experience, they are capable of stopping anywhere, anytime, at any cost.

I don't know about the brakes, only their unreliability.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old July 31st, 2014, 05:59 PM
Holiday's Avatar
Holiday
Status: Offline
Ross Simpson
1995 D90 ST/2006 D3 HSE7
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hamilton, VA
Posts: 456
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky View Post
For the sake of anyone reading this in the future, the error in your argument is assuming that a 19 year old chassis is still safe. I've seen 2004 Discovery chassis with holes big enough to put a fist threw. Take that chassis and add another 19 to it...well even you should understand the consequences of that.

The important thing here is that the OP, as I said before can make his own decisions, which will fit in with his needs. That's not for you to dictate.



Rocky/King- listen guy, don't take it personal- it's the guidance that I'm disagreeing with, not singling you out personally. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but that doesn't mean that it should go uncontested. The "OP" just made a decision based on the guidance you provided, which is based on some 04' Disco chassis up in NE that you put your fist "threw" (it's "through", btw). Again- it's not age, it's condition.


Based on your age argument- we're all living dangerously by driving around in NAS trucks with corrosion free chassis's...


Craig (and others)- good luck in making your decision on cross-members. Just went through this process myself last year. I've provided my two cents (more like $20/worth!).
Out.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old July 31st, 2014, 06:11 PM
cgalpin's Avatar
cgalpin
Status: Offline
Charles Galpin
'94 D90 ST, '63 SeriesIIA
Site Team
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: South Riding, VA
Posts: 11,625
Registry
Ross did you weld the galvy crossmember on yourself? I can tell you from experience that what the others have said is true. You have to grind off the galvy and even then you are going to get exposed to a lot of toxic fumes. The welds are not going to be as good. And I'd be surprised f you were not charged a premium for that. But as others have also said, I think with proper treatment a non-glavy replacement can be protected well enough to survive the life of the chassis. The original would have too with proper treatment like POR-15

Again just my opinion, but I'm in the non-galvy camp for this.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by pendy
I'm here for the D's
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old July 31st, 2014, 06:59 PM
Holiday's Avatar
Holiday
Status: Offline
Ross Simpson
1995 D90 ST/2006 D3 HSE7
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hamilton, VA
Posts: 456
Registry
Quote:
Originally Posted by cgalpin View Post
Ross did you weld the galvy crossmember on yourself? I can tell you from experience that what the others have said is true. You have to grind off the galvy and even then you are going to get exposed to a lot of toxic fumes. The welds are not going to be as good. And I'd be surprised f you were not charged a premium for that. But as others have also said, I think with proper treatment a non-glavy replacement can be protected well enough to survive the life of the chassis. The original would have too with proper treatment like POR-15

Again just my opinion, but I'm in the non-galvy camp for this.




Charles- I hear you, but did you read the posts? Not contesting that welding galvy is easier, or better for your health. Neither are a factor for Craig anyway, who is paying a professional to do the work (and will likely use proper PPE).


I agree in my posts above that a steel (uncoated) cross-member can be protected by proper care, but for a couple of hundred bucks extra- why worry about it?
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old July 31st, 2014, 07:12 PM
Holiday's Avatar
Holiday
Status: Offline
Ross Simpson
1995 D90 ST/2006 D3 HSE7
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Hamilton, VA
Posts: 456
Registry
My welded galvanized crossmember before POR-15 was applied, for a factory look.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	photo 1.JPG
Views:	70
Size:	104.5 KB
ID:	99833   Click image for larger version

Name:	photo 2.JPG
Views:	67
Size:	111.1 KB
ID:	99834  

Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old July 31st, 2014, 07:58 PM
Jonesy's Avatar
Jonesy
Status: Offline
Craig
87 D110 (Ruby)
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Leesburg, VA
Posts: 4,447
Registry
Hey Ross - trust all is well mate.

The flaw in your opinion is that you start with a perfectly good chassis in the first place. Unfortunately these bitches rust from the inside out...so when you finally see an issue it is waaaaaay too late. It normally manifests itself in the "hollows" of which the xmemebr in the rear is the #1 spot, followed by the front horns then the bump stop areas and so on...the logic in the argument is that a good/xcellent chassis is fine and welding on a galvy member is better...BUT....that logic is unsound when given the level of effort and certainly the issues with welding galvy. If you put a brand new steely on AND treat it (and the rest of the chassis) real well then it is (a) easier to weld and (b) by your logic just as good or better than the rest.

At the end of the day - steel to steel if in great condition -----or relace everything with a galvy chassis
__________________
"The difference between stupidity and genius, is that genius has its limits." - Albert Einstein
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Defender Source > Classifieds > Wanted

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rear Cross Member NIB NAS D90 ST rwillms For Sale - Parts 3 July 17th, 2013 05:30 PM
Wanted: Rear Reflector for Cross Member 95/97 D90 JQ11 Wanted 0 January 14th, 2013 11:40 AM
WTB New Rear Cross Member NAS 90 lordhelemt Wanted 6 January 10th, 2013 07:33 PM
d90 rear cross leafsprung Wanted 0 March 15th, 2012 12:44 PM
D90 Rear Replacement Cross Members SafariHP The Vendors Loft 0 November 15th, 2009 10:14 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:43 PM.


Copyright